The Come Up
RockWater, Chris Erwin
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Interviews with entrepreneurs and executives who are shaking things up and building exciting new companies. In industries like new Hollywood, podcasting, ecommerce, and the metaverse. Entertaining you with stories you won't hear anywhere else, from the next generation of leaders that are going to change the world.
Brought to you by Chris Erwin, the founder of RockWater and 15-year veteran operator, seller, and investor of media, commerce, and technology companies.
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Nov 10, 2022
Taehoon Kim — CEO of nWay on Raising $90M, Selling to Animoca, and Gaming x Web3
This interview features Taehoon (TK) Kim, Co-Founder and CEO of nWay. We discuss going to arcades with his mom in South Korea, why he wasn't allowed to play console games as a kid in Canada, what he learned from Samsung's work culture, why it's hard for VCs to invest in gaming, finding passion at the intersection of technology and art, the best type of IP for game partnerships, how he ended up selling nWay to Animoca Brands, and how player ownership in games creates attachment and meaning, and prevents gamer exploitation.
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Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.comInterview Transcript
_The interview was lightly edited for clarity._
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Taehoon Kim:
So I was really upset when Lightspeed thing fell through. I went out drinking with my friends and I got hammered that night. I had another VC pitch the next morning. I was so hungover that during the presentation I threw up three times. During the pitch, I would say, "Excuse me, I'd run to the bathroom." I would throw up, come back, continue the pitch. And I did that three times., And I did the presentation 9:00 AM I came home and I was, "Oh, my God, I totally screwed that up." I fell asleep. I woke up at 4:00 PM, got a call at 5:00 PM saying that he was in. Usually it doesn't happen that way, but it was a really weird period of time in my life.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features TK Kim, CEO of nWay and a serial gaming entrepreneur. So TK was born in Seoul, South Korea to a mom who was a gamer and a lover of arcades. After studying at Cornell, TK started his career at Samsung, where he helped launch their smartphone and next gen mobile gaming businesses. TK then went on to co-found three gaming companies, and raised over $90 million in venture capital. Today he's the CEO of nWay, which is a developer, publisher, and tech platform for competitive multiplayer games across mobile, PC, and consoles. nWay was sold to Animoca in 2020.
Some highlights of our chat include why he wasn't allowed to play console games as a kid in Canada, why it's hard for VCs to invest in gaming, finding passion at the intersection of technology and art, why he doesn't mind getting rejected by investors, the best type of IP for game partnerships, and how player ownership in games creates attachment and meaning and prevents gamer exploitation. All right, let's get to it.
TK, thanks for being on The Come Up podcast.
Taehoon Kim:
Hey, thanks for having me. Super excited to be here.
Chris Erwin:
We have a pretty amazing story to tell about your career, but as always, we're going to rewind a bit and kind of go to the origin story. So it'd be awesome to hear about where you grew up and what your parents and what your household was like.
Taehoon Kim:
I was born in Seoul, Korea, and then I moved to Vancouver, Canada when I was in fourth grade. I think I was 10 or 11. At the time, growing up in Seoul, a little bit more strict environment. One funny thing is that my mom was a gamer and she would take me to the arcade, I think when I was super young, five or six years old. That's when I got really into gaming and how fun could that could be. But when I moved to Canada, however, she didn't really let me have any consoles, when that switch from the arcade era to the console era happened.
I think she was a little bit influenced from the Asian culture and didn't want me to be getting too loose on academics. But when I got the computer, that's when I started really getting back to gaming. She didn't know I was playing games, but I was really into that. And then when Doom came out, that's when I really also started getting into online gaming, which is a big part of the reason why I'm so into PVP and competitive gaming.
Chris Erwin:
So your mom was a gamer and she would take you to the arcades in Seoul. What were the types of games that you guys liked to play together? And was this just something special that you and your mom did? Or was it a whole family outing that you did with your mom and dad and your siblings?
Taehoon Kim:
My dad didn't really like games, so it was just me and my mom. And she was really into Galaga and getting on the top of the leaderboard there. Oftentimes, I would watch her play and I would also try, but I wasn't as good as her. So I mean, I would mostly try to beat a record, but I couldn't. That's how I got into it early on.
Chris Erwin:
Did you also go to the arcade with a lot of your peers growing up when you were in Korea? And did any of your peers parents play? Or was it kind of like, I have the cool mom, she's into gaming, and we'd go do that on the weekends?
Taehoon Kim:
Oh, later on when I got older and I got in elementary school, yes, I definitely did go to the arcade with my friends. And then later on, in Seoul, arcades turned into PC bang. I'm not sure if you heard of it, but it's like the room full of PCs and it would play PC games there. I mean, I got in earlier than my friends, because of my mom.
Chris Erwin:
Remind me, what was the reason that you guys came to Vancouver from Korea?
Taehoon Kim:
I'm not a 100% sure if this is the real reason, but my parents would always tell me it's because I wasn't really fitting well with the type of education in Korea, where it was more, much more strict and less creative. They wanted us, me and my brother, to get a Western education. I think it turned out to be good for me, I guess.
Chris Erwin:
Do you remember when you were kind of joined the academic and the school system in Vancouver, I know it was at a young age, you were about 10 years old, you said, did you feel that that was like, "Hey, this is immediately different and I really like it and enjoy it"? Or was it nerve-wracking for you to make such a big change in your life to be uprooted at such a young age? What were you feeling at that time?
Taehoon Kim:
It was immediately different, lot less grinding. Even at third or fourth grade, back in Seoul, it was pretty tough. After school was over at 5:00 PM, I still had to go to all these after school programs until 9:00 PM or something like that. And I didn't do the homework afterwards and everybody was doing it. So there was a lot of peer pressure for parents to also put their kids to the same kind of rigorous program. And when I was in Vancouver, I didn't have to do any of that. So it felt more free and math was a lot easier.
Chris Erwin:
Math was a lot easier in Vancouver.
Taehoon Kim:
You know how crazy it is for Asian countries with math early on.
Chris Erwin:
So you're probably the top of your class. You were such a standout, and I bet at a young age that was pretty fun because it was easy to you too.
Taehoon Kim:
People thought I was super smart. I wasn't, it was just that I started earlier doing more hard stuff in math. It wasn't necessarily that was smarter. But again, on the other subject, because my English was suffering, I had to get a lot of help. So I would help them in math and they would help me with the other subjects.
Chris Erwin:
And you mentioned that in Western education there's also probably more emphasis on using the creative part of your brain as well, and balancing that out with the math or the quantitative side. What did that look like to you as you were going through middle school and high school before you went to college? Any specific applications or stories stand out?
Taehoon Kim:
Yeah, one thing that stood out to me was how a lot of the homeworks and assignments were project based and group based. Where teamwork mattered, and I would have to work with two or three other students to do a project, where we had a lot of freedom to create what we wanted. And the fact that…
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Oct 13, 2022
Zach Blume — Co-Founder of Portal A on 2006 Web Series, the Wheelhouse Investment, and Building with Your Childhood Friends
This interview features Zach Blume, Co-Founder and President of Portal A. We discuss how he built a 360 monetization strategy for an early Internet video series, launching one of the first branded content studios with his childhood friends, creating one of the most well-known and longest-running digital formats in YouTube Rewind, how Portal A ended up selling a minority stake to Brett Montgomery's Wheelhouse, why feeling like outsiders is central to their identity, and what's up next for the Portal A team.
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Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.comInterview Transcript
_The interview was lightly edited for clarity._
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to the Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Zach Blume:
We built a business model around it that included merchandise, ad revenue share, ticketed events, and sponsorships. And so we actually ran that show at a profit, even though it was early internet video web series. And the idea was to build an entertainment property on the web that could become multi-season, could eventually travel to TV, which it did. It later became a TV series called White Collar Brawlers. It was super experimental, and I would say, looking back on a fairly innovative for three guys who had really no idea what we were doing and had no training in any of this, we built an entertainment property on the internet that was profitable.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode featured Zach Blume, Co-Founder and President of Portal A. So Zach grew up in Berkeley and had a self-described normal suburban life of sports and friends. Zach then went to University of Oregon to study political science and pursued an early career running local political campaigns in California. But an opportune moment reunited Zach, with his two childhood friends to create one of the internet's earliest digital series White Collar Brawlers.
After some unexpected success, the friend trio then became the founding team for Portal A, an award-winning digital and branded content company. Some highlights of our chat include his 360 monetization strategy for one of the earliest internet video brands, what it takes to co-found a successful company with your friends, how they landed a strategic investment from Wheelhouse, why feeling like an outsider is central to their identity, and how they're building towards the next massive creator opportunity.
All right, let's get to it. Zach, thanks for being on the Come Up podcast.
Zach Blume:
It's a pleasure to be here.
Chris Erwin:
From our conversation yesterday, amazingly, I believe this is your first podcast interview ever. Is that right?
Zach Blume:
It's true. A lot of interviews over the years. Some predating the podcast era, some during the podcast era, but I'm honored to be invited onto yours. I've listened to a bunch of episodes, and we'll see how it goes.
Chris Erwin:
Awesome. All right, so as is typical, let's rewind a bit before we get into the whole Portal A story, although it actually starts pretty early on. So why don't you tell us about where you grew up and what your childhood was like?
Zach Blume:
Yeah, I grew up in Berkeley, California, the son of two die-hard New Yorkers who had moved out to California. My dad was born in the Bronx. My mom was from Manhattan. They were part of the New York exodus to California, and I was the first kid in my family who grew up in California and, of all places, Berkeley, childhood filled with lots of sports and playing in the street and all that good stuff. And the really interesting tie to the Portal A story, obviously, is that I met my two co-founders when we were somewhere between four and five years old. The stories differ, but we met in kindergarten, and we're close friends basically since we were little kids and played a lot of basketball together growing up. And the court that we played basketball in was called Portal A, which eventually became the name of our company 25 years later. The founder story of Portal A is very tied up in the childhood story of all for all three of us. I live in Oakland now, so I didn't stray too far from home.
Chris Erwin:
Got it. I remember in doing a little bit of research for this episode, I was trying to look up Portal A parks around the US, and I kept finding some in Orange County, so I thought you were an NorC kid, but No, you're a NorCal kid.
Zach Blume:
I mean, I think if there's an opposite of Orange County, it would probably be Berkeley.
Chris Erwin:
That's probably right.
Zach Blume:
But the court was actually an El Cerrito, which is an adjacent town to Berkeley, and it still exists. It's still around, and we should probably go play some hoops over there, but we haven't for years.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah, that'd be fun. So I have to ask, what did your parents do?
Zach Blume:
My dad has a business background. He runs and, up until actually six months ago, ran an investment advisory firm helping individuals manage their investments. It was a small company, five to six employees, just a great business, really community based, all about relationships and helping people manage their life and their money. And yeah, it's taught me a lot about business growing up, for sure.
My mom was a therapist. She's retired now. She was a private practice in Berkeley. They've known each other since they were 20. They actually both went to the Wright Institute, which was a psychology graduate school in Berkeley. My dad was a psychologist briefly for about six months before he went back into business. And my mom was a therapist for 25 years. It was an interesting mix of business and psychology growing up, for sure.
Chris Erwin:
Got it. And were there any siblings?
Zach Blume:
No siblings? I'm the only one and-
Chris Erwin:
Oh, only child. Okay.
Zach Blume:
Yeah, interestingly, five of my closest friends, all groomsmen at my wedding, were from that same kindergarten class where I met Nate and Kai, my two co-founders. So there's definitely been a brotherly nature of those relationships. And at this point, I kind of consider Nate and Kai almost like brothers. We've known each other for 35 years, and we've been in business together for over 12 years, so it's pretty deep. Those relationships run pretty deep.
Chris Erwin:
Was there a part of you early on where you thought you might go into business and finance or become an investment manager like your father?
Zach Blume:
So there was also a lot of political kind of conversation and learning in my house. I remember from a very early age, my dad, when I was like eight, he would try to sit me down and read the Sunday Weekend Review in the New York Times. And it was like torture for me. But I think it got in there somewhere.
In college, I actually studied political science and, for years, worked in the political world after I graduated from school. And I really thought that was my path, and it was for many years. I worked on campaigns. I started managing campaigns. I worked for political communication shop in San Francisco for years. I kind of burned out on the world of politics. I've since been re-engaged in a lot of different ways. But when I burned out on politics, that's when I thought I was going to go into business.
I left the political world, was studying to go to business school, doing all the GMAT prep, and that's when Nate and Kai came to me and said, "We should make a web series together." Because I had a three-month gap, and it sounded so fun. We had made some stuff together just for fun earlier on. And so, while I was studying for the GMAT, I joined Nate and Kai to make this web series in the early days of internet video. And that's kind of the origin story of where we are today is that that web series, it was called W…
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Sep 15, 2022
Camila Victoriano — Founder of Sonoro on Building LA Times Studios, Latinx Podcast Innovation, and Following the Story VS the Medium
This interview features Camila Victoriano, Co-Founder and Head of Partnerships at Sonoro. We discuss how fan fiction taught her to see nerds as heroes, being in the room when Dirty John was pitched to become a podcast, her crash course to figure out the business of podcasting, becoming a first time founder during COVID, why the Mexico audio market is like the US four years ago, Sonoro's growth to a global entertainment company, and why there are no limits to Latino stories.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow us on LinkedIn: RockWater LinkedIn
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.comInterview Transcript
_The interview was lightly edited for clarity._
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Camila Victoriano:
So in 2017, we had a meeting with the editor in chief at the time, and he was like, let me sit you guys down and read you this out loud. And it was what would become Dirty John. That's when we realized there's something here that I think could be our first big swing in audio and in podcasting. And we got to talking and at that point we were like, I think we can do something here. And I think there's a story here to be told in audio. When it launched, it took us all by surprise with how well it did. Obviously we knew it was a good story, but I think you never know when something's going to be that much of a hit. Today, it probably has over 80 million downloads.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Camila Victoriano, co-founder and head of partnerships at Sonoro. So Camila grew up in Miami as a self-described nerd with a passion for books and fan fiction. She then went to Harvard to study English, literature and history, which led to her early career, starting at the LA Times. While there, she became a founding member of their studios division and a “audio champion”. Then in 2020, she went on to co-found Sonoro, a global entertainment company focused on creating premium, culturally relevant content that starts in audio and comes alive in TV, film and beyond.
Sonoro collaborates with leading and emerging Latinx storytellers from over a dozen countries to develop original franchises in English, Spanish, and Spanglish. Some highlights of our chat include how fan fiction taught her to see nerds as heroes being in the room when Dirty John was pitched to become a podcast, her crash course to figure out the business of podcasting, becoming a first time founder during COVID, why the Mexico audio market is like the US four years ago and why there are no limits to Latino stories. All right, let's get to it. Camila, thanks for being on the podcast.
Camila Victoriano:
Yeah. Thank you for having me. Excited to be here.
Chris Erwin:
For sure. So let's rewind a bit and I think it'd be helpful to hear about where you grew up in Miami and what your household was like. Tell us about that.
Camila Victoriano:
Yeah. So I grew up in Miami, Florida, very proud and loud Latino community, which I was very lucky to be a part of, in the Coral Gables Pinecrest area for those that know Miami and my household was great. My dad, he worked in shipping with South America. My mom was a stay at home mom. And so really as most kids of immigrants, I had obviously parents I loved and looked up to, but it was very different than folks that maybe have parents that grew up in America and knew the ins and outs of the job market and schools and things like that. But really great household, really always pushing me to be ambitious and to reach for the stars. So I was, yeah, just lucky to have parents always that were super supportive. Questioned a little bit, the English major, that path that I chose to go on, but we're generally really happy and really supportive with everything that I pursued.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah. And where did your parents immigrate from?
Camila Victoriano:
My mom is Peruvian and my dad was Chilean.
Chris Erwin:
I have been to both countries to surf. I was in Lobitos in I think Northern Peru and I was also in Pichilemu in Chile and yeah, just absolutely beautiful countries. Great food, great culture. So do you visit those countries often?
Camila Victoriano:
I visited Chile once, much to the chagrin of my father, but Peru, I visited so many times and yeah, they both have incredible food, incredible wine. So you can't really go wrong. I did Machu Picchu and Cusco, and that sort of trip with my mom once I graduated college, which is really great just to go back and be a tourist in our country, but they're both beautiful and yeah, I love going back.
Chris Erwin:
Oh, that's awesome. All right. So growing up in your household, what were some of your early passions and interests? I know yesterday we talked about that you had an early interest in storytelling, but in some more traditional forms dating back to the ‘90s, but yeah. Tell us about that. What were you into?
Camila Victoriano:
I was always a huge reader. It's funny because my parents read, but not super frequently. My grandparents were big readers, but I always, always gravitated towards books. I remember, like many people of my generation when I was six, I read the first Harry Potter book and that was just mind blowing for me and I think...
Chris Erwin:
At six years old? Because I think I learned to read at like five.
Camila Victoriano:
Yeah. I had help with my mom a little bit but I remember we read it together and we would just mark with a crayon every time where we ended on the page. But I remember that book was like, I think when I first really understood how detailed and how enveloping worlds could be. And I think starting from that point, I just went full on into fantasy, YA, all sorts of books. I was just reading obsessively. It also helped that I was a classic nerd in middle school and high school and all throughout childhood, really. So I think for me, books, literature stories were just a way to see the world, see people like me, a lot of times in fantasy books or in sci-fi books in particular, you have the nerds as heroes.
And so I think for me, that was a big part of why I gravitated to those genres in particular. But yeah, I just read all the time and then I did light gaming. So I played the Sims, again, similar idea though. You're world building. You're living vicariously through these avatars, but that was really how I spent most of my time, I obviously played outside a little bit too, but I was a big indoor reader always.
Chris Erwin:
Got it. This is interesting because the last interview I just did was with Adam Reimer, the CEO of Optic Gaming, and we talked a lot, he was born in the late ‘70s. So he was like a 1980s self described internet nerd as he says, before being a nerd was cool. So he was going to web meetups at bowling alleys when he was just a young teenager. Over through line with you because he was in Fort Lauderdale and you grew up in Miami. So two Florida nerds.
Camila Victoriano:
Yeah. Nerds unite. I love it.
Chris Erwin:
Nerds unite. You also mentioned that you also got into fan fiction. Were you writing fan fiction? Were you consuming it? Was it a mix of both?
Camila Victoriano:
A mix of both. So that's really in middle school in particular, how I really bonded with my small group of friends. I remember my best friend and I, we connected, we were on the bus reading a Harry Potter fanfiction on at that point it was fanfiction.net. And that is also again, similarly because in person with people, it was just like, we weren't really connecting that much. And so that community online was huge for me and my friend. We read all the time, people had comments, you had editors that you worked with and we wrote them ourselves too. And I think, looking back in the retrospective for me, that's where I think I first started to…
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Aug 4, 2022
Mike Grisko — CFO at Atmosphere on Raising $150M, Becoming a 2x Founder, and the Future of TV for Business
This interview features Mike Grisko, CFO and Co-Founder of Atmosphere. We discuss running an NCAA tourney at age 7, getting laid off during the Great Financial crisis, almost selling the Chive to Playboy, the challenge with professional politeness in UK work culture, raising $150 million in growth capital and quadrupling the team in 5 years, and what he looks forward to next.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow us on LinkedIn: RockWater LinkedIn
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.comInterview Transcript
_The interview was lightly edited for clarity._
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Mike Grisko:
We have this concept internally, like giving up your Legos. Your job description changes every three to six months when you're going through rapid growth. 18 months ago, we were less than 100 people. Yeah, today we're close to 450 employees just at Atmosphere. And so that requires you to change your roles. Some of the things that I was doing back in 2018, 19, 20, it's just not scalable at that level. And so being able to hire great people, reassign tasks and responsibilities is absolutely critical.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Mike Grisko, co-founder and CFO of Atmosphere. So Mike was born in the south side of Chicago and was the oldest of five siblings. He then studied at University of Illinois and his early career started in finance and consulting, including Pricewaterhouse Coopers in London and Moelis & Company in Chicago. While at Moelis, he met the founders of The Chive and was recruited for his first C-suite role as CFO. Soon after relocating to Austin, Mike partnered up with The Chive's leadership team to co-found Atmosphere, where he is helping to grow and scale the leading streaming TV service for businesses offering free audio optional TV. Some highlights of our chat include running an NCAA 20 at age seven, getting laid off during the great financial crisis, almost selling The Chive to Playboy, the challenge with professional politeness in UK work culture, raising 150 million in growth capital and quadrupling the team in five years, and what he looks forward to next. All right, let's get to it.
Chris Erwin:
Mike, thanks for being on the podcast.
Mike Grisko:
Yes, absolutely. It's a pleasure to join you on The Come Up. Really looking forward to getting into it.
Chris Erwin:
There's a lot of stories to tell here. As always, we're going to rewind a bit and we're going to talk about where you grew up and your childhood. So I think you're a Midwest kid. Tell us about that.
Mike Grisko:
I am a Midwest kid. Grew up on the south side of Chicago. 103rd and Pulaski for any local Chicago listeners. Was the oldest five kids. My mother was a ER nurse. My dad worked in engineering sales. It was a great spot to grow up. It was very much a blue collar neighborhood. We lived right across the street from Tally's Corner, which was famous for just so many cops and firefighters that had to live within the city limits. My mom was one of seven. My dad, one of four. And everybody lived within a couple miles of each other. So just cousins everywhere. So yeah, it's a fun neighborhood to grow up in. I don't know what your childhood was like, Chris, but it was very Stranger Things for us. You just go on your bike, you'd be gone all day. You just got to be back before the street lights came on.
Chris Erwin:
Oh, I hear you. I was born in '82, so I'm an '80s, '90s kid. And in the suburbs I was born Rumson, New Jersey, an hour outside the city. And it was about like, you get on your bike and you just travel all around the county and you get into trouble, you find dirt jumps, you go meet up with your friends late night. I remember taking the bikes out at 3:00 AM during sleepovers. It was the best.
Mike Grisko:
It was the best. Was Chicagoan through and through before. Now residing in Austin, Texas.
Chris Erwin:
So, okay. Being the oldest... I have two brothers, I have a twin and then a younger brother who's six years younger. And so you're the oldest of five. What was your role? Did you have a patriarch type role amongst the brotherhood?
Mike Grisko:
Absolutely. Especially my dad traveled quite a bit for work. It was definitely more of a patriarchal role took on but still. We were just very tight knit crew. Still are.
Chris Erwin:
Getting into middle school and high school. What were some of your passions back then? What did you like to do?
Mike Grisko:
We were always playing sports. You had the neighborhood crew. You're playing fast pitch against a parking lot wall. In addition to doing sports, it was also a bit of a nerd. Constantly reading, just super competitive in school. It was less about the learning, it was more just getting better marks than anybody who was around me. But yeah, that stuck with me for quite a while.
Chris Erwin:
Got it. Well, look today, you're the CFO and co-founder of Atmosphere and you've also had a CFO role at Chive. So were you big into the quant side and into mathematics and other science and other similar subject areas?
Mike Grisko:
Yeah, there's a bit of that. And then I've just always been incredibly fascinated by business and markets. Grew up in the '80s and when I was a... I think it was six or seven, my uncle started calling me Gordon Gekko. I think because I was the only-
Chris Erwin:
It's a great nickname.
Mike Grisko:
I know. I think it's because I was like the only seven year old who was running an NCAA tournament and I was doing betting spreads every NFL Sunday going down the line. Yeah. So it definitely makes sense, the career path that I chose, doing finance, doing the investment banking thing and choosing this direction.
Chris Erwin:
Kind of makes sense because you end up going for undergrad to the University of Illinois where you focus on finance and accountancy. So when you went to school, what were you thinking that you were going to do afterwards?
Mike Grisko:
When I got down there I wasn't really sure. It wasn't until I actually did study abroad program, which was in Melbourne Australia, which was some of the best months of my life. It was just absolutely incredible. Yeah, the fact that my best friend and I both got full scholarships to go down there was just such a deal. I mean, we got accepted. We just could not believe that they took both our applications.
Chris Erwin:
What did you get into? Did you do any surfing while you were out there?
Mike Grisko:
Did do some surfing, played Aussie rules football. We tried to get stuck into everything, just being able to travel and just the people and just such a fun environment. But that's really when I took a step back and started looking at like, "Okay, when I get back, I got to figure out an internship." And that's when chatting with a bunch of folks, really started to lean towards trying to get on an investment banking track. And so it's amazing. Sometimes you do really need to take a huge step away to start to piece that all together and figure it out. Because I really had no clue probably up until then.
Chris Erwin:
It's funny. It's almost a bit of the reverse, but it reflects your personality and your interests. Typical consultants or Fortune 500 executives or bankers will go on a sabbatical and say, "I don't want to be in these industries anymore. I'm going to go do something different." But you go to Australia, have the time of your life and you're like, "I need to go into hardcore finance. That's the path." I went in a very similar direction. I was an investment banker right out of undergrad too. All right. So that becomes your focus. What's your first internship or your first role in school?
Mike Grisko:
So I did an internship for Wells Fargo. Got to see the lending side, their corporate…
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Jul 7, 2022
Adam Rymer — CEO at OpTic Gaming on 1980's Internet Nerds, Adapting to Napster, and the Future of Esports
This interview features Adam Rymer, CEO of OpTic Gaming. We discuss what he learned from running Harvard’s campus store, adapting to Napster at Universal Music, why entertainment doesn’t value innovation, being on Universal Pictures’ greenlight committee, scaling Legendary Digital and working alongside Chris Hardwick and Amy Poehler, how to create communities for gamers, why he plays Fornite with his son, and how to follow your own roadmap.
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Interview Transcript
_The interview was lightly edited for clarity._
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Adam Rymer, CEO of OpTic Gaming.
So Adam was born in Fort Lauderdale and was a self-described '80s internet nerd. That meant hanging out on internet bulletin boards and attending internet meetups at bowling alleys. His online passions paid off and he ended up going to Harvard after writing an admission essay, comparing entertainment dollars versus grocery store dollars. Adam's early career included Universal Music where three months after beginning his new role Napster was launched. And Adam had to figure out questions like, "What now? And who do we sue?" After rising up to the exec ranks at Universal Adam then struck out on his own to co-founder production company that worked on projects like the Rover and sci-fi hit arrival. He then became president at nerd and legendary networks where he helped build a multi-platform media business alongside stars like Chris Hardwick and Amy Poehler today. Adam is the CEO of OpTic Gaming, where he is helping to grow and scale one of the world's most exciting companies operating at the intersection of gaming and entertainment.
Chris Erwin:
Adam, thanks for being on The Come Up Podcast.
Adam Rymer:
Great to be here, man. Good to see you.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah. So where are you calling in from?
Adam Rymer:
I am in Dallas, been here about two years now.
Chris Erwin:
Are you in the Envy offices right now?
Adam Rymer:
We are. I moved here in the middle of COVID and we've been, believe it or not, working mostly in the office since I got here.
Chris Erwin:
Like to hear that people getting back to the office environment. Well, we're going to talk about Envy more, but actually want to rewind a bit, Adam. So going back a few years here, I want to hear about where you grew up and a little bit of what your childhood was like to see if there's any kind of glimpses into this media and digital executive that you've become.
Adam Rymer:
I am a Florida man. I grew up in Fort Lauderdale. Born in Miami, grew up in Fort Lauderdale, '70s and '80s which whatever anybody thinks about Miami and south Florida now is not what it was like when I was there. It was retiree paradise. And then the occasional spring break debauchery but of course, I was too young to really understand and appreciate any of it. So I just saw all these college kids coming in and thinking that would be awesome. And then by the time I was actually old enough to enjoy spring break, that it all gotten kicked out of south Florida and moved to Daytona and Cancun and wherever else. So missed out on all the benefit of all of it. But Florida was an interesting place to grow up in the '70s and '80s. Left at 17, never really went back, but definitely helped shape my desire to stay someplace warm for the rest of my life.
Chris Erwin:
Okay. So I have to ask you, what was your household like growing up? Were your parents into the same things that you're into now, media entertainment, digital gaming, gaming, what that looked like back in the day was very different, but what did your parents do and what were some of your early inspirations?
Adam Rymer:
My dad was a physician. He was an immigrant. My mom helped run the household. I had a younger sister who was six years younger than I. And so we were not overly close partially because of the age difference. And partially because we were just into different things, I was probably what you would call a quintessential nerd back in the day when it was very, very uncool to be a nerd. I got an Apple 2e when I was, I don't know, probably like eight or 10 years old and was goofing around on that with floppy discs and playing Zork and all the text base games and whatever else I could get my hands on. I remember connecting to BBSs back in the day. That was how I spent a lot of my free time.
Chris Erwin:
But BBS?
Adam Rymer:
Yeah. BBS was a bulletin board system. It was the modern, the old precursor to, I guess what you'd call like a social media network today. It was dial-in multi-communication platform where you could type and talk to other people and play games with people online, text-based games for the most part and south Florida, believe it or not, was actually the hub of some of the biggest BBS companies in the .country every now and then we'd go to meetups with people who were on these, these services, but you'd get online and play trivia and you'd play just chat with each other. And I guess back in the day, you'd consider it pretty weird. And today you just call it WhatsApp.
Chris Erwin:
So question, you said we would go to meetups. How old are you and who is we? Are you going with your parents or friends?
Adam Rymer:
Yeah. I was like 13, 14, and I'd have friends that would drive me around. We'd meet at like bowling alleys and family entertainment centers like arcades and mini golf places. And there'd be people from 14 to 40, but everybody was just connected through these online environments of being... At the time, I guess we were outcast and ostracized. And like I said, we were big old nerds.
Chris Erwin:
Were your parents supportive of some of your interests here with these meetups and the BBSs?
Adam Rymer:
Yeah, I mean, they didn't really know what was going on. For me, it was just a way to meet people and make friends and met some really interesting folks. Met some really odd, strange folks through it. Some people went on to greatness and do some pretty cool things. Some people faded off into obscurity. I think it definitely helped define and set my career in motion from being part of something that was just on the cutting edge of interactivity and technology. And 'cause there was a lot of steps to it, right. We had to, you had to get a 300-baud modem. You had to connect a phone line to it. You had to pay for time on the service by dropping off some money at a house or sending something in somewhere else. And I mean, it was really complicated, but we made it work. It was a weird time. It was like during the days of war games, if you remember the movie War Games, it was like that sort of universe.
Chris Erwin:
I've known you for years now. This is the first time I've really asked about your upbringing in your childhood. And within one minute, learn something completely new, but it makes sense. Everyone nowadays talks about how do you build community? How do you build fandom amongst different media brands, participants, creators, and users, et cetera? And you have now three to four decades of experience of building fandom on the internet. It's all becoming much more clear. So as you go to high school and then you're applying for college, what did you think that you were going to do?
Adam Rymer:
It's funny so we used to go to Disney World a lot in Florida, right? Because it's only about two-hour drive from where I lived. And I was always, I guess, kind of a weird business-focused kid at a certain level. I remember writing my college essay about Disney, but not about the cool entertainment factor of Disney about the business of Disney and how I found it super interesting that when you would go to someplace like Disney World, that you would be totally open to spending $8 on a Mickey…
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Jun 9, 2022
James Creech — Paladin CEO on Selling to Brandwatch, Influencer SAAS, and Recasting Success
This interview features James Creech, SVP Influencer Strategy at Brandwatch and founder of Paladin. We discuss how former GE CEO Jack Welch inspired James to be a number one category leader, using his down payment on a house to start Paladin, his make or break pivot when the creator economy evolved in 2018, working till 3AM over Christmas to sell his company, why James and I are kindred spirits, and the power of recasting your success.
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Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
James Creech:
Thomas and Ole and I all put considerable capital into the project. To put that in perspective, at the time, Thomas was getting married. His fiancé, she was amazing to say, "We believe in this dream, and we want to put that money that we would have saved for a big, nice wedding with our family and friends towards investing in this startup." I had been saving to buy a house, so I took essentially a down payment on what I would do to buy a house and said, "I'm all in on the business." Every penny to my name and probably even some I didn't have like went into Paladin. Then, Ole had recently gone out and bought a Tesla. He ended up driving back to the dealership and returning the Tesla, so he could take all of that money and put it into Paladin. So, every single one of us was all in from day one.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features James Creech, SVP influencer strategy at Brandwatch and founder of Paladin. So, James was born in Houston, Texas and grew up in Bakersfield, California with parents who worked in oil and gas. Early on, James was a creative. In high school, he made sketch comedy videos with his friends and thought film and TV was his future. So, he went to USC Film School and ended up running the college TV station, but soon realized that he really enjoyed and was good at the business side of entertainment. His career started at a video advertising startup, where he helped scale the team to over 40 employees, but then moved on to Bent Pixels, which started as an early YouTube MCN.
Chris Erwin:
While there, James took a big bet on launching a technology SaaS product for the early creator economy, which he ended up spinning out and leading as CEO, until its recent sale to Brandwatch just a few months ago. Today, James leads influencer strategy at Brandwatch and stays busy on the side, advising over 10 different companies and publishing content on his podcast and blog. Some highlights of our chat include how former GE CEO Jack Welch inspired James to be a number one category leader, when he used his down payment on a house to start Paladin, his make or break pivot when the creator economy evolved in 2018, working till 3:00 AM over Christmas to sell his company, why James and I are kindred spirits, and the power of recasting your success. All right, let's get to it. James, thanks for being on The Come Up podcast.
James Creech:
Hey, Chris. Thank you, excited to be here.
Chris Erwin:
This has been a bit of a long time coming. I think I was on your podcast a year or two ago, and I said, "James, I'm going to have to get you on mine someday." And, we're finally making it happen. When we were doing the prep, I just got even more excited, because I realized just how cool and exciting your story is. So, excited to share that with the listeners, and as always, let's rewind a bit. So, we're going to go back. Tell us about where you grew up, what your household and what your parents were like.
James Creech:
So, I was born in Houston, Texas, but grew up mostly in Bakersfield, California. So, I always tell people, "You could probably guess what my parents did for a living, right?" We worked in oil and gas. So, I spent most of my life, yeah, in Bakersfield, from ages four to 18, essentially. My childhood was great. I have a younger brother and sister. We're a close family. We had the chance to do a lot of traveling when we were younger, which was fun. I remember soccer practice and tennis and Cub Scouts, mock trial. We were involved in a lot of activities, and our parents were very much a part of those activities and the stuff that we enjoyed as kids.
Chris Erwin:
Quick interjection, how far did you get in Cub Scouts?
James Creech:
To the end of Cub Scouts. Never made it to boy Scouts.
Chris Erwin:
Did you achieve the Webelos badge?
James Creech:
Yeah, I was a Webelos. I think that's about as far as I made it.
Chris Erwin:
Nice. I did one up you a bit. I got to Eagle Scout with my twin brother.
James Creech:
Congrats. Wow, that's a huge achievement.
Chris Erwin:
It's a lot of work. Back to you, so grew up in Bakersfield, had some younger siblings. Early on, what were your passions? What were you into? Was there any glimpse into the career that you have today?
James Creech:
I think when I was a kid, I used to tell people what I wanted to be when I grew up, I said I wanted to be the governor of California. I don't know where that came from. I don't know that I have any sort of interest or passion in politics. I think as I got older, I would say I lacked the moral flexibility to pursue a career in that field, but was interested in politics and government early on. Somehow, that morphed into maybe being interested in law and going to law school at a certain point. I was pre-law at USC, so that was certainly a passion. I ended up doing the mock trial, as I mentioned, and then interned at a law firm and realized, hey, a lot of love for the legal profession, a lot of great friends who are lawyers, et cetera, but that probably wasn't the path for me.
James Creech:
In high school, the thing that really captured my intention was making videos with my friends, essentially comedy shorts. It's interesting, the timing, right? I was inspired by SNL and all these other amazing sketch comedy programs. Had I been a generation later, let alone maybe even five years later, the videos I made probably would've ended up on YouTube and now TikTok. But, because of the timing, I just made videos with my friends, and we made DVDs and shared them with our friends and family. But, it wasn't any sort of big distribution.
Chris Erwin:
It's never too late, James. It's never too late.
James Creech:
Yeah. There's an archive of a lot of old, embarrassing footage somewhere.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah, IP libraries are in high demand, high valuation. So, there could be something there.
James Creech:
So, that's what I was doing and figured, okay, well, I'm interested in media and entertainment. I applied and was accepted into the USC Film School and thought, okay, I'm going to go into film production, right? Fast forward a little bit, and I realized in college, well, I'm way more interested in the business side than I am in say the creative or the technical side. The stuff I liked doing in high school with my friends was making videos, which was really more about the experience of being together, less about the filmmaking process. But, yeah, that was kind of the early days.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah. So, I have to ask, what was your role in doing these sketch comedy or sketch segments? Were you a director? Were you a writer? Were you an actor? Was it all the above? And, I also want to hear, if you just have an example of one of the things that you guys did, I'd love to hear about it.
James Creech:
Oh, boy. So, I was an instigator. A ringleader is maybe the right word. We did all sorts of stuff. We were filming on these really small handheld cameras. I would certainly come up with sketch ideas and get my friends involved. We would shoot them. I would edit them. We would share them. There's plenty of stories that I can tell you…
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Apr 14, 2022
Michael Cohen — CEO at Team Whistle on Wall Street to Digital, Scaling $0-100M, Leadership, and Exits
This interview features Michael Cohen, CEO at Team Whistle. We discuss being denied by a Goldman Sachs recruiter, when wearing a suit can be bad for business, being on the launch team of Whistle Sports, why the movie The Martian inspires his leadership, executing an M&A roll-up strategy and going from $0-100M in revenue, exiting to ELEVEN Group, and learning how to “play it where it lies”.
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Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Michael Cohen:
The presenter started off his presentation, and he said, "None of you in this room are going to get a job at Goldman Sachs right out of school." Sort of the most deflating thing ever. I've been preparing for this for an ungodly amount of time. And I was so angry for so long, but what I took away from that has stayed with me for my entire career, because what he then went on to say was, "I didn't start a Goldman Sachs. I started at X company. I then went to Y, then over to company A, and ultimately got to where I am today as a managing director at Goldman Sachs." And his point was that not all career paths are linear. You have to have different experiences along the way that ultimately allow you to become a better managing director at Goldman Sachs, or wherever you were going.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Michael Cohen, CEO of Team Whistle and chief transformation officer of ELEVEN Group. Michael was born in Long Island and grew up with parents who worked in tourism and technology. He decided to migrate to Atlanta for college, kicked off his career in a financial training program at Wells Fargo, but he soon returned to his home turf in New York City to be an investment banker, where Michael learned how to tell stories with numbers. Of note, this is where we first met and actually worked together for a few years.
Chris Erwin:
Michael's career then progressed into private equity and strategy consulting, but he left to take an early bet in digital media and helped launch Whistle Sports in 2014. Today, Michael is the CEO and has spent the past year integrating the business into its new owner, ELEVEN Group. Some highlights of our chat include being denied by a Goldman Sachs recruiter, when wearing a suit can be bad for business, why the movie "The Martian" inspires his leadership, executing an M&A roll up strategy and going from zero to a hundred million in revenue, and learning how to play it where it lies. Now I've known Michael for over 15 years, and he's one of my favorites to share industry notes with and riff about all things creator economy. Telling his story has been a long time coming, so let's get to it.
Chris Erwin:
All right, Michael, thanks for being on the podcast.
Michael Cohen:
Chris, thanks for having me. Been a long, long time that we've known each other, so I'm excited to chat with you.
Chris Erwin:
Yeah. This has been a long time coming. I think I've been asking you to be on the podcast for almost over a couple years now. There was some assumed perhaps missed emails or lack of responses or who knows what, but finally able to make it happen today.
Michael Cohen:
I take the fifth, but I'm glad I'm glad to be here today.
Chris Erwin:
All right, Michael. I've known you for a long time. I think dating back to 2006. This is ... I know. It's pretty crazy to say that. It's almost over 15 years starting in Wall Street finance into the world of digital media. A lot to talk about today, but let's start where you grew up, if there's any glimpses into your early career. Let's rewind a bit and tell us about where you grew up and what your household was like.
Michael Cohen:
I grew up in Long Island in New York, a nice, quiet suburban town called Jericho. I have an older brother and my two parents as well. The town was a very small town. Everybody knew each other, which was great, but also a little bit of a bubble. And so I think having grown up in that environment, it was something that I liked a lot, but also knew it was something I needed to get out of and experience the world a bit different. And I think part of my childhood allowed me to do that. My mom worked in travel, which allowed us to go to all different places. Some I appreciated at the time. Some, I certainly did not as a kid. Whish I could go back and appreciate some of those more, but again, this is well before we had digital cameras, let alone Instagram.
Michael Cohen:
You couldn't experience a culture the way you potentially can today through Instagram or other apps. I got to have a feel for other cultures around the world through that lens. And then my dad worked in and around technology for his entire career, which was pretty awesome. He traveled to Japan a lot. And I would always ... We went to the consumer electronic show, when CES was actually consumer electronics, or at least more prominently consumer electronics. I would inevitably have some new gadget. I remember a small, little TV that had a massive antenna that I got channel two on, which was great, super exciting as a kid. And then I definitely had the first MP3 player, which I think it was called the Diamond Rio.
Chris Erwin:
It could hold five songs?
Michael Cohen:
Yeah. It literally had I think five songs. You could upgrade the memory and you might get eight songs. It was literally the coolest thing ever, but you'd use it to go for a run because you had a Walkman. That was the only other thing. And if you do more than a 20 minute run, that's kind of it. But I think being around my mom and dad who were both working, gave me a strong appreciation for hard work and work ethic. I think both of the industries that they were in gave me perspectives that I probably wouldn't necessarily have had. I'd say my older brother, in terms of work ethic, not to say he didn't have great work ethic, but he is wildly smart. And he didn't actually have to work all that hard to do really well, which, on the other hand, I believe I'm somewhat smart, but also had to do a lot of hard work to keep up. That's just something that's always driven me.
Chris Erwin:
Michael, I think you have many moments of great intelligence, so don't cut yourself short there. All right. With your mother in travel, your father in tech, did you have a sense of what you wanted to do as a kid? Did a lot of people in your community work in New York City? Did they work in finance? What were you thinking about your careers you were preparing for college?
Michael Cohen:
Yeah, we had a lot of different folks in the neighborhood. Some worked in finance, some accountants, a variety of folks that worked in different industries. I think for me, business was something that was always an area where I wanted to focus. I knew I wanted to be a business man at that time, follow predominantly in my dad's footsteps and be able to work with a great company and travel, be a part of important meetings, a big team. All that stuff was important to me. Exactly where and what that meant was certainly TBD. Again, we didn't have internet, and all that stuff wasn't as prevalent as it is today to sort of understand all the options and choices.
Chris Erwin:
And actually, a quick tangent to that ... As a kid, what were your hobbies? What were your passions? What did you do outside the classroom?
Michael Cohen:
Played a lot of sports. I grew up in a neighborhood that after school, all of us would get our bikes. We'd go to a park. We go back to the school. We'd play pick up basketball, roller hockey, baseball, you name it. We were out until dinnertime. And that was just awesome, being able to always be playing sports. And then at home, I would say because I…
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Mar 17, 2022
Brendan Gahan — CSO at Mekanism on YouTube in 2005, Selling Epic Signal, and Your First 100 Drafts
This interview features Brendan Gahan, Partner and Chief Social Officer at Mekanism. We discuss working with OG YouTubers like Smosh back in 2005, founding Epic Signal and selling it to his former employer, hanging out in El Salvador’s Bitcoin Beach, why it takes him 100 drafts to publish content, the future of the creator economy, and learning how to enjoy what you create.
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Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Brendan Gahan:
I felt like my strengths could be better utilized going off on my own. It was really as simple as, well, I want to do this work the way that I know how to do it and the way I want to do it. And if that takes me going off on my own, then that's what I'm going to do. So I did. In hindsight, it sounds much smarter than it was. It was not smart from like an on paper standpoint, but I just felt like it was the right thing for me to do because I've been doing it longer than most people, I have relationships, I have a sense of what strategically works. I want to do it the way that I want to do it.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Brendan Gahan, partner and chief social officer at Mekanism. So Brendan was born in Ventura, California, and grew up surfing many local breaks. But although his parents were educators, he entered college without a career focus. But just a few weeks away from graduation, a last minute call from his uncle sparked his entry to media and advertising, and he never looked back. His career started at a creative agency working on some of the first YouTube campaigns with hit creators like Anthony Padilla and Ian Hecox's Smosh. With a growing reputation as a social and digital expert, Brendan eventually started his own agency, Epic Signal, which he ended up selling to Mekanism.
Chris Erwin:
Today, Brendan is their chief social officer. On the side he also publishes a wide array of content, making it one of the industry's most well regarded thought leaders. Some highlights of our chat include what it was like to sell his company to his former employer, why he's hanging out in El Salvador's Bitcoin Beach, how it took him 100 videos to post his first TikTok, the future of the creator economy, and learning how to enjoy what you create. All right, let's get to it.
Chris Erwin:
Brendan, thanks for being on The Come Up Podcast.
Brendan Gahan:
Thanks for having me, pumped to be here.
Chris Erwin:
We were just having a little chat about, you got a surf in this morning, if that's right.
Brendan Gahan:
I did. I'm working in El Salvador this week in a little town called Zonte, people may have heard of it referred to as Bitcoin Beach. And there's a nice little right hand point here, so made sure to get out there.
Chris Erwin:
Are you regular foot or goofy foot?
Brendan Gahan:
I'm regular, yeah.
Chris Erwin:
Okay, so you like the right-handers. I'm goofy, I like to go left.
Brendan Gahan:
Yeah, right hand point in particular, it's like my favorite kind of wave. I grew up in Ventura. So grew up surfing C Street, at the point in Ventura. And then every once in a while I would make the trek up to Rincon and stuff.
Chris Erwin:
I'm curious, where exactly did you grow up? Were you in the LA County or were you up north?
Brendan Gahan:
No, I was in Ventura. So there's Ventura County, which encompasses quite a bit of Southern California, but I grew up in the city of Ventura, maybe three quarters of a mile away from the beach, it's like a 15-minute walk or so, and yeah, it was great.
Chris Erwin:
Great. And do you still have family that's in Ventura?
Brendan Gahan:
Parents are still there. I've got some aunts, uncles, cousins in the area. And then my younger sister lives, she's still in Ventura County, but about 30 minutes away from where we grew up.
Chris Erwin:
I often talk about Southern California real estate. And you look at one of the few pockets in SoCal that's near the beach that has been underdeveloped is definitely Ventura. I think that's true for the last 30 years. I think that's finally starting to change, particularly during COVID and remote work. Have you seen that there?
Brendan Gahan:
Oh my gosh, it's crazy. I was just there this past weekend. And there's all these developments going up, like apartment complexes and condos, and yeah, it's sort of interesting. When you look at Ventura on a map, there's sort of like this no man's land between LA and Santa Barbara. And for years, Ventura was just sort of like overlooked. It was like people would pass through Ventura to go to either Santa Barbara or LA, but then more and more Ojai started to become a place, and Ventura has become a bit of a destination and there's now some startups out there. Before the biggest company there was Patagonia. Ventura, growing up was sort of like this blue collar cowboy meets surfer vibe for the most part. And yeah, that's definitely evolving.
Chris Erwin:
I think cowboy meets surfer vibe sounds about as good as it can get, you know?
Brendan Gahan:
Yeah, yeah.
Chris Erwin:
I forget who, but when I was at Big Frame almost 10 years ago now, I remember there were some industry friends that had set up shop in Ventura and were commuting to LA, and it was only about like an hour, hour and 15 away, not that crazy if you timed it right. So curious, looking at you being at the nexus of digital media and advertising and all the things, were there any media influences when you were there, when you were younger? Did that come from your parents or anything like that? Or was your upbringing focused on completely different things?
Brendan Gahan:
Yeah, definitely not. LA seemed like the furthest thing in the world to me growing up. And it seemed like a city, it may as well have been New York in my mind. Even though it was only like an hour and a half, we would go to LA on a field trip every couple years, or maybe my parents would take us there and we'd visit a museum or something like that. But it was not like a destination that was really on my radar. And from a professional standpoint where my head was at, I sort of had the cliche jobs in mind, it was like, oh, okay, maybe I'll be a teacher or a lawyer. A lot of people I knew growing up, and a number of relatives were like firemen, so my mind was sort of gravitating towards, I thought I'd either be a doctor, a lawyer or a psychologist. So I didn't have much of like a media or a tech influence until later.
Chris Erwin:
What did your parents do?
Brendan Gahan:
They were both in education. So my mom was a teacher's assistant in resource classes. And then my dad initially was like a teacher and then became a principal at a number of the special education schools in Ventura County. And then when he retired, he was the director of special education in Ventura. So education ran deep in the family, I guess.
Chris Erwin:
Yes. No, clearly understood. But I think you mentioned that you had an uncle that was in the media space, right?
Brendan Gahan:
That's right. Yeah, yeah. So I had an uncle who worked in advertising and he was at Wieden+Kennedy like in the heyday when it was like Bonos, Air Jordan, all that, when it was as big as it could get, and they lived a ways away. But whenever I saw him, I would just like pepper him with a million questions because to me, somebody working in advertising, in particular on like Nike and in that era, it wasn't just ads. It was like shifting culture, like Spike Lee and all that stuff. So I thought it was the coolest thing in the world. And I'd always ask him a million questions about it. But in my mind I never thought that I would end up working in that space. It seeme…
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Feb 3, 2022
Sarah Penna — Creator Launch Exec at Patreon on Her $15 Million Exit, Marrying a YouTuber, and Betting on Creators
This interview features Sarah Penna, Senior Manager of Creator Launch at Patreon. We discuss how a trip to India inspired her media career, being one of the youngest YouTube MCN founders, her $15 million exit to DreamWorks Animation, how she picks co-founders, marrying a YouTuber-turned Hollywood filmmaker, founding a female-forward entertainment brand, and what’s up next for Patreon.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Sarah Penna:
We had outgrown the office. We were in the National Lampoon office. It was so janky and eventually we moved the talent team to my dining room table. I would cook dinner for the talent team. We would take talent meetings in my living room, which was just so bizarre and unprofessional but worked. My house was kind of a YouTuber hotel. It was very wholesome and very duct tape and bubble gum feeling. We were just kind of figuring it out.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Sarah Penna, senior manager of Creator Launch at Patreon. So, Sarah was born in Salt Lake City, Utah. Her father was a serial entrepreneur and her mother ran the family construction business. Sarah's first foray into media began while studying abroad in India, when she became the translator for a documentary film crew. So after college, she moved to California and immersed herself in LA's up-and-coming digital media scene, which included working with OG YouTuber Phil DeFranco. Sarah rapidly became a digital expert and started her own digital talent management company in 2010, which eventually became Big Frame and was sold to AwesomenessTV and its parent, DreamWorks Animation.
Chris Erwin:
Today, Sarah runs a team that helps Patreon develop and launch premium talent partnerships, and also advises Frolic Media, a female-forward entertainment brand she co-founded in 2018. Some highlights of our chat include how we first met during an awkward interview moment with a guitar, when having 10,000 subs made you a Top 100 YouTuber, how she picks co-founders, what it's like to marry a YouTuber turned Hollywood filmmaker, and what's up next for Patreon. Now, I've known Sarah for nearly 10 years. She was actually my gateway drug into all things digital entertainment and where it not for her founding Big Frame, I would not be where I am today, and I am forever grateful to her, which makes me super pumped to share her story. All right, let's get to it. Sarah, thank you for being on The Come Up podcast.
Sarah Penna:
Thanks for having me.
Chris Erwin:
We got a little bit of history here. So, we'll see how much of that we can get through in 90 minutes before your next thing.
Sarah Penna:
Yeah, it's a lot. It's a lot to pack in.
Chris Erwin:
As always, let's rewind a bit and let's talk about where you grew up. So, my understanding is that you grew up in Salt Lake City, Utah. Your family had some land in Wyoming. I think your dad was a bit of an entrepreneur, but tell us about your upbringing.
Sarah Penna:
Yeah. I had a pretty cool childhood. I grew up in Utah. My parents were total hippies, just big personalities, did not grow up in the predominant faith of Utah. So, it was a little bit of an outlier, and my parents own a construction company together. So, a little bit of foreshadowing into how I worked with my husband at one point, but I grew up with an older sister and a younger brother. We had a menagerie of animals all the time, like goats, and my dad kept bees at one point. We always had two or three dogs and a bunch of cats and an iguana and chinchillas. We just had this kind of crazy Bohemian, bizarre, Jewish, hippie not Mormon family.
Sarah Penna:
So, my parents owned this construction company and became relatively successful with that but my dad has curse, as I do, which is, always coming up with new ideas and deciding to act upon them. He had a Japanese restaurant and he had a furniture company and he had an emergency preparedness kit company, and I-
Chris Erwin:
Would he do all of these at the same time as the construction business or would it be like stops and starts and all of that?
Sarah Penna:
No. My mom held it down. She really was the mastermind behind the construction company. She did all of the office work and made sure ... she really ran the company and then my dad was kind of the face of it. He was out at the job sites and in the early days, was actually doing the building. So, I got to see my mom be in this, talk about a male-dominated industry. She would come home so mad because she would get a piece of mail that ... her name's Paula and they would always address Paul, because they couldn't believe that a woman was running a construction company. So, I got to see this powerful woman running this super successful business in basically a hundred percent male-dominated industry.
Chris Erwin:
Sarah, I've known you for over 10 years and we worked together intimately for at least three or four of them. I had no idea about your background. I just learned more about you in two minutes. It took a podcast and a 10-year relationship to get here.
Sarah Penna:
That's totally my bad.
Chris Erwin:
All good. So, okay. As a kid, when your father dabbled in all these new business adventures, was that really exciting for you guys? Maybe frustrating for your mother, but as kids you're like, "Oh, dad's up to some cool stuff again."
Sarah Penna:
Yeah, it was fun. I was 15 when he did the Japanese restaurant and I got to work in the restaurant and just, it was cool, and I didn't realize the stress and the financial burden that it was putting on my mom and kind of how frustrating it was for her but I see that now, looking back, and she handled it amazingly. She's an incredible woman. But I'm a very early riser, and as a kid, I would ... my dad is, too. He would get up at four or five in the morning and I would, too. He would just load me up in his construction truck and we'd go get pancakes and go milk the goats and go check on his construction sites. So, I got to see the inner workings of that. Then, I love going to the office and rifling through my mom's office supplies.
Chris Erwin:
Well, I got some important Post-it notes here, got a yellow legal pad, all the things.
Sarah Penna:
It was so fun as a kid. You're like, pens and Post-it notes, and the office supply closet was just like this heaven.
Chris Erwin:
My dad, he ran a psychology business and still does for 40 years and had his own office, and then every year he hosted a conference. One of my favorite things is that he would hire his children, me and my twin brother, and we'd have to lick 500 envelopes and put stamps on them. But we got to use all of these office gear, we thought it was the coolest thing ever. Then, after a few years, we're like, "I think we're getting sick from all of this stamp-licking."
Sarah Penna:
Yeah, probably.
Chris Erwin:
But separate story.
Sarah Penna:
That's really funny.
Chris Erwin:
So, a question, watching your father's entrepreneurial endeavors and also your mother, too, running the business, did you feel like, "Hey, when I grew up, I'm going to have my own business too."
Sarah Penna:
Honestly, no. So, I was an incredibly shy child. I was very quiet. My family likes to joke that they thought I was just going to buy a cabin in the woods and just frolic in daisy fields and that would basically be all I could handle. So, to the shock of everybody, of what I wound up doing with my career, so no, I was very directionless. I went to a very intense high school that was a college prep school. There was a lot of pressure to kind of figure out what you wanted to do. Frankly, I jus…
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Dec 16, 2021
Dev Sethi — Head of Sports at Instagram on Launching a Sports MCN, Athlete Creators and NIL, and Metaverse Fandoms
This interview features Dev Sethi, Head of Sports at Instagram. We discuss being separated from his twin in highschool, his side door into sports at YouTube, launching the first sports MCN at Whistle, why NIL is this century’s most important breakthrough for athletes, why he left the incredible team at Complex for Instagram, and the metaverse’s impact on the personalization of sports.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Dev Sethi:
One of the things that I love sharing with the teams that I've managed, and the individuals I've managed and that's important to me is how do you empower those team members' voices, whether you're to 23 and out of college with no work experience, or 35 and have been in social, and digital, or in sports for decades plus, we all see what we do, our industry, what's happening differently than anybody else, and almost by sheer virtue of who you are and the life experiences that we all bring to these jobs. So if I'm, as a manager, as a team leader, able to create an environment or a safe space for people to share, that's how we're going to get better.
Chris Erwin:
This week's episode features Dev Sethi, Head of Sports at Instagram. So Dev was born in the DC metro area, the first generation immigrants from India. Then in high school, Dev's life journey took a big turn after a traumatic family event and some wise words from a teacher which inspired him to become school president and captain of both the baseball and basketball teams. Dev then went on to Notre Dame, and soon after found a side door into sports media at YouTube's new partnership. He then left to help build digital communities at publishers like Whistle and Complex. But after a heart-to-heart with his mom, Dev reverted course, and returned to big tech as Head of Sports at Instagram.
Chris Erwin:
Today, Dev is shaping the future of sports fandom. Some highlights of our chat include being separated from his twin in high school, launching the first sports MCN, why NIL is this century's most important breakthrough for athletes, and the metaverse's impact on the personalization of sports. I've known Dev for over five years. He's one of the sharpest and kindest minds in the digital verse, I'm grateful to help share his story. All right, let's get to it. Dev, thanks for being on the podcast.
Dev Sethi:
Thank you for having me, nice way to spend my Wednesday afternoon.
Chris Erwin:
Yes. And appreciate it because I think you had some last minute dental work that was just done this morning, is that right? Can you still talk?
Dev Sethi:
Yeah. I don't know if folks are going to consume this entirely audio or even visual, but got last minute dental work done this morning so part of my mouth is still numb, Chris might see me drool out one of the sides of my mouth. But hopefully, I'm not slurring my speech too badly, and I promise you, if I am, it's because it's because of the Novocaine, it's not because of any other reasons. Oh, here we go.
Chris Erwin:
Well, Dev, what I can say is I think you sound great, and I don't think many of our listeners will be able to see the video, but you look great as well, as always. So you're good to go for my book.
Dev Sethi:
Making me blush already. Okay, let's do this thing.
Chris Erwin:
All right. So with that, Dev, let's rewind a bit and let's talk about where you grew up, your childhood interests and if there may any glimpses into what you were going to do in your sports media career from an early age, in some of our prep chats, you're telling me about growing up in the DC metro area, is that right?
Dev Sethi:
That is correct. And it's actually where I'm currently based as well, but grew up in Nolan, Virginia, literally adjacent to Washington DC. My parents are immigrants from India and that's where they ultimately ended up settling. So I'm certain that folks that are listening to your podcast can sympathize with me being a long suffering Washington area sports fan, that's basically epitomized my experience being a sports fan in this area, but grew up here and had a great time. It's actually quite a diverse area, and for those who have been to Nolan, Virginia and the DMV overall, it's changed quite a bit since I was a kid, it's virtually night and day how much this area has evolved over time.
Chris Erwin:
Your early household, growing up, were your parents into sports, immigrating from India? Did they have ties to the US leagues, and sports programs, or international? What was that like?
Dev Sethi:
Yeah, nothing prior to them arriving on these shores. My father was a sports fan and played sports growing up, but very different sports obviously in his own country than the US. But for certain listeners who I'm certain have had the same experience as I've had, but sports was and is an incredibly powerful way to assimilate into a new place, whether it's a new community, a new state, or let alone a new country. And so my father quickly adopted American sports as an interest, a hobby, an enthusiasm. And again, for those who are familiar with this area as much, there is a thriving Indian community or South Asian community in the DMV. And one of sort of its rallying cries was and is sports.
Dev Sethi:
And so, I have a lot of great fond childhood memories of going to Washington watch parties, and when you're showing up for Thanksgiving, the guys show up early, because they want to watch all three games on Thanksgiving before anyone starts feasting. And it just really was a big part of my growing up. And I think a great way for my parents to get comfortable in what was then an unknown environment for them, So it's a really big part of, I think, my personal history as well as my parents history.
Chris Erwin:
And did you have siblings that were also consumers of sports as well?
Dev Sethi:
I have an older brother who is four years older. He's not in this industry, so he will likely never listen to it so I can trash his athletic gifts. I think he played soccer and basketball but sort of gave it up early-ish in his life to focus on being more of an academic, which is why he's a lot smarter than I am. But I also have a twin brother who is equally a sports junkie, a passionate fan of pretty much all things sports. And he and I played basketball and baseball growing up together, and we were watching sports ourselves. So a very big sports house so I like to joke that I missed out on all the Disney movies like Cinderella and all those kinds of movies Beauty and the Beast, I have watched virtually none of them because on Friday, Saturday and Sundays, we normally have a sporting game on TV.
Chris Erwin:
I've known you for a few years now. And I don't think I knew that you were a twin. I'm also a twin as well. Did you know that about me?
Dev Sethi:
I did not know that about you, wow. Identical over fraternal?
Chris Erwin:
We are fraternal, but we look a lot alike. He took a very different career path than me, he's in the military, 82nd Airborne at Fort Bragg, ranger qualified, so he's just at a physical level that is well beyond where I'm at. But it's funny, thinking of growing up with him, I grew up in my family, we didn't watch a lot of sports, but we played a lot of sports. My brother and I were very athletic and active growing up. So when you said on Friday, Saturdays and Sundays, you weren't watching Disney movies because you are consuming, my brother and I, we would get up at 6:00 AM and go hit the basketball courts at like 6:30 or 7:00 on a Saturday. As soon as it was like my parents were up and we were allowed to get out of the house. That was what was fun, w…
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Nov 18, 2021
Brian Volk-Weiss — CEO at The Nacelle Company on Netflix's 1st Streamer Deal, Betting Big on Comedians, and Toy Shopping Therapy
This interview features Brian Volk-Weiss, CEO at The Nacelle Company. We discuss why betting big on standup specials got him Netflix's first streamer deal, how Iowa taught him about empathy in content production, bombing on stage and the genius of comedians, producing The Movies That Made Us, toy shopping as therapy, and why he'll retire when his first feature film is greenlit.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Brian Volk-Weiss:
I'm shocked any of this worked. So much of what we built was theoretical for so long. And the fact that there's almost no greater feeling than watching the moment a theory becomes a fact. We were…
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Oct 7, 2021
Doug Bernstein — GM at House of Highlights on AOL's "Digital Mailroom", Sports Fandoms, and Fulfilling His Destiny
Doug Bernstein is the GM at Bleacher Report's House of Highlights. We discuss what he learned from launching his own fantasy sports website, predicting the future of sports fandoms, how he convinced Turner and Bleacher Report to buy House of Highlights, why he’s inspired by Faze Clan and 100 Thieves, and fulfilling his destiny as a sports media savant.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Doug Bernstein:
Very early on in House of Highlights' lifespan, I became a really big fan of the account. I think we had about 500,000 followers. At this point, we would have these quarterly board meetings, and I ran through this deck, wh…
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Sep 9, 2021
Alison Eakle — EVP at Shondaland on Being 1st to Netflix, Bridgerton, Promotions After 30, and Motherhood
Alison Eakle is the EVP and Head of Creative Development at Shondaland. We discuss how imagining movie posters makes her a better creative exec, being a co-EP on Netflix’s #1 show Bridgerton, why she’s racked up so many recent promotions, and being part of new Hollywood’s most groundbreaking streamer partnerships.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Alison Eakle:
I'll never forget there was... The current assistant had put out a job posting. And how this works in Hollywood is you'll see jobs on things called tracking boards or emailed chains, but they always say, "No phone calls, please. Just email your resume." Right…
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Aug 19, 2021
Naomi Shah — CEO of Meet Cute on Raising $6M During COVID, Leaving VC, and Rom-com Podcasts
Naomi Shah is the founder and CEO of Meet Cute. We discuss Naomi's early passion for STEM, being a Goldman Sachs equity trader, leaving VC to be a founder, why a rom-com podcast network solves a problem in the wellbeing market, raising $6M of capital during COVID, and how a non-Hollywood background makes her a better media entrepreneur.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Naomi Shah:
At the early stages, it was exploratory, "Let's make one of these stories, let's figure out how this process works." I was actually on the investment team at USV when I started working on this idea. I had a really close relationship with the pa…
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Jul 22, 2021
Dan Levitt — CEO of Long Haul Management on $6,000 Salaries, Disney's Big Miss, and Cracking YouTube SEO
Dan Levitt is the founder and CEO of Long Haul Management. We discuss how Dan paid rent while making only $6,000 a year out of college (many side hustles), beating me in an office rap battle, Disney's big miss in digital music, executive producing one of YouTube's premium original series, and what it's like to represent some of the biggest sports and gamer personalities on the Internet.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Dan Levitt:
I chose the safer Disney route. Again, I needed to pay the bills. But I made a promise to myself. Every day, I saw someone else doing what I wanted to do. They were the AbsolutePunks of the world. Or there were oth…
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Jun 24, 2021
Damian Pelliccione — CEO of Revry on Launching a Queer TV Streamer, 4x Founder Diversity, and Grassroots Power
Damian Pelliccione is the co-founder and CEO of Revry. We discuss saying no to his family cheese business, being an early expert in live video for car shows, launching the 1st Queer streamer network from his living room, how a delayed mortgage and the launch of QueerX festival almost bankrupt the company, the power of grassroots marketing during SF Pride, how diversity inclusion starts with ownership, and changing the narrative for the Queer community.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Damian Pelliccione:
Cut to November, around Thanksgiving of 2015. I was playing a new Apple TV. You install it on your TV and you search for apps of apps that…
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Jun 3, 2021
Matthias Metternich — CEO of Art of Sport on Being a 5x Founder, Skincare for Athletes, and Pitching Kobe Bryant
Matthias Matternich is the co-founder and CEO of Art of Sport. We discuss growing up as the son of a German ambassador, starting his first company at 14, when Brexit devalued his investment capital, selling women's smimwear, pitching Kobe Bryant, his 500 mile trek in the Alps, and redefining body and skincare for athletes.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Matthias Metternich:
I remember Brian and I thinking, well, who represents the kind of tenacity, and focus, and mental and physical commitment to being the best version of yourself possible. Done so successfully that they've transcended their sport. And it really took u…
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May 6, 2021
Kevin Jones — Founder of Blue Wire on Getting Fired for a 49ers Tweet, $3.5M from WynnBet, and the Future of Sports Podcasts
Kevin Jones is the founder and CEO of Blue Wire. We discuss getting fired over a 49ers Tweet, when it makes sense to be a bad Facebook employee, why 500 Startups first turned him down, his groundbreaking new WynnBet partnership, and why Kevin wants to be the Ted Turner of this generation.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Kevin Jones:
What once was a prestigious job at a radio station is now not. They don't develop young talent and it really came to a head for me in San Francisco. They have not developed young personalities the last 10 to 15 years, everyone there who has a show is in their 50s or above. A year in, I reali…
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Apr 7, 2021
Chris Ovitz — President at OK Play on Being a 3x Founder, Humble Leadership, and Reimagining Kids Screen Time
Chris Ovitz is the Co-Founder and President of OK Play. We discuss growing up in a Hollywood family, building technology-enabled media companies, life revelations during an Alabama roadtrip, "humble magnetism", launching a venture fund with the co-founder of Twitter, YouTube as a babysitter, and why the future of play is putting kids at the center of story and creation.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Listen to our weekly executive insights on Media x Commerce news: Mondays at 2pm PT on Clubhouse via @chriserwin
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Chris Ovitz:
There's so much guilt in general for parents, and then there's all this judgment around screen…
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Mar 17, 2021
Aditi Dash — Partner at CircleUp on Surprise FDA Visits, Clubhouse, and Consumer Investing
Aditi Dash is a Partner at CircleUp and invests in consumer brands like Beyond Meat, nutpods, and Black Medicine. We discuss emigrating from India at age 8, being told to "not sit at the table" while working at Morgan Stanley, taking the advice to "get out of the building" during a surprise FDA visit at La Colombe Coffee, and why hormone health and the convergence of Media x Consumer excite her as an investor.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Listen to our weekly executive insights on Media x Commerce news: Mondays at 2pm PT on Clubhouse via @chriserwin
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Aditi Dash:
The FDA showed up at the plant that I was running, and…
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Feb 24, 2021
Aaron Levant — CEO of NTWRK on Launching 30 Event Brands, Why Ignorance Is Rich, and Shopping at the Speed of Culture
Aaron Levant is the CEO of NTWRK. He's one of the most exciting builders at the intersection of fashion, culture, events, and media. We discuss launching a profitable car magazine at age 9, pitching Marc Ecko on ComplexCon, raising tens of millions for NTWRK from star investors like Jimmy Iovine and LeBron, being "oppositionally defiant", and how he thinks about his career in thirds.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
---
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podast that interviews entrerepreneurs and leaders.
Aaron Levant:
This is a common theme in my career, which some people say ignorance is bliss, I like to say ignorance is rich. What I mean by that is it's like every single thing I've done I don't know anythi…
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Feb 3, 2021
Kevin Gould — CEO of Kombo Ventures on $75 Million of Beauty Sales, Liquidating His IRA, and the Hottest Role in Town
Kevin Gould is the founder and CEO of Kombo Ventures. Many people say they’re the bridge between Hollywood and Silicon Valley, but Kevin’s the real deal. We discuss why he outsourced his script coverage as a young talent agent, when he liquidated his IRA to start angel investing, how "sliding into DMs" helped him launch 3 beauty brands with $75 million in sales, and how I misjudged Kevin when we first met.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
--
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi. I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Kevin Gould:
I did two things. One was I played credit card arbitrage. The second was I think I had forgot what I had in my Roth IRA at the time and I cleared the Roth IRA account an…
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Jan 10, 2021
Gretta Cohn — CEO of Transmitter Media on $7,000 of Startup Capital, Touring with Bright Eyes, and Making Beautiful Things
Gretta Cohn is the founder and CEO of Transmitter Media. Gretta's experience runs the gamut of all things audio, from public radio and ringtones, to producing chart-topping podcasts. We discuss her time touring with the band Bright Eyes, being hired as the first production executive at Midroll Media and Earwolf, and starting her own podcast company with only $7,000 of savings.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
--
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Gretta Cohn:
I thought I would take the more productive path, the one where I didn't leave podcasting and I made this decision in December of 2016 to myself and then spent the next couple of months just tucking away…
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Dec 17, 2020
Mike Gaston — President of Stage TEN Studios on Bankruptcy, Founding Cut.com, and the Future of Livestreaming
Mike Gaston is the President of Stage TEN Studios, and a creative and social provocateur known for "programming between the lines". We discuss launching a profitable poetry press and soon after declaring personal banktuptcy, selling his first music video to MTV, founding viral digital studio Cut.com, and how he’ll shape the future of livestream media.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
--
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Mike Gaston:
This is going to sound insane. And I'm going to share this, but my thought was, is it possible to rob a bank and not go to jail? I'm like 19. Now when I'm thinking this way. And then I thought, yeah, I'll just take out a bunch…
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Nov 18, 2020
Christian Baesler — President of Complex Networks on German Village Life, Being a DJ, Hot Sauce, and ComplexLand
Christian Baesler is the President of Complex Networks. Christian is a young media savant, who in his 20’s had more media experience than most executives have in a lifetime. We discuss his humble German childhood, how he launched Bauer Media's digital business at just 21 years old, being a touring DJ, and Complex's international growth plans for 2021.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
--
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews, entrepreneurs and leaders.
Christian Baesler:
I was there first as the student, still at my program. And I basically took the initiative to say, "Well, you say there is no opportunity here, why don't I just build a case study for you?" And so I programmed a website,…
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Oct 28, 2020
Chas Lacaillade — Founder of Bottle Rocket Management on $5,000 Startup Loans, Jerry Maguire Moments, and the Digital Video Revolution
Chas Lacaillade is the founder and CEO of Bottle Rocket Management. Chas took a big bet on the digital video revolution, and now builds businesses for some of the most exciting creative talent from New Hollywood. We discuss why he left a prestigious talent agency to sell water pumps, Louisiana roadtrips, and how he converted a $5,000 bank loan into a multi-million dollar business. Full episode transcript is below.
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Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Chas Lacaillade:
I had my Jerry Maguire moment where I called all my clients and said, "Am I your manager? Am I your manager? And if so, this is my new endeavor, I'm going out on…
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Oct 7, 2020
Adam Sachs — COO of Team Coco on Early Podcast M&A, Group Dating, and Being Foolishly Confident
Adam Sachs is the COO of Team Coco and a veteran podcast and digital media executive. Adam works with some of the biggest names in Hollywood like Conan O'Brien, and even Barack and Michelle Obama. We discuss his time as CEO of Midroll Media and its sale to E.W. Scripps, founding a group dating website that he sold to IAC, and the power of being foolishly confident. Full episode transcript is below.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Chris Erwin:
Hi, I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up. A podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Adam Sachs:
I think we were foolishly so confident. We just thought, "Oh, we have a great idea, so it's going to be successful. Let's just quit our jobs and start this business." And didn't reall…
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Sep 16, 2020
Nicole Staple — Founder and CEO of Brideside on Investor Bias, Cancer Battles, and Rap Lyrics
Nicole Staple is the co-founder and CEO of Brideside. Nicole and her team reinvented the bridal shopping experience, and have raised more venture capital than any other female-led business out of Chicago. We discuss investor bias towards women, managing through rapid growth during her husband's cancer battle, and what rap lyrics have to do with ending meetings. Full episode transcript is below.
Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
Email us: tcupod@wearerockwater.com
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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Chris Erwin:
Hi. I'm Chris Erwin. Welcome to The Come Up, a podcast that interviews entrepreneurs and leaders.
Nicole Staple:
I don't think they knew Sonali was pregnant and we never mention it. She was eight months pregnant. She was big. He came, he left and they told us they were passing because we were loc…
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Aug 13, 2020
Welcome to The Come Up
Introducing a new podcast featuring entrepreneurs and executives who are shaking things up and building exciting new companies. In industries like New Hollywood, podcasting, ecommerce, and the metaverse. Entertaining you with stories you won't hear anywhere else, from the next generation of leaders who are going to change the world.
Brought to you by Chris Erwin, the founder of RockWater and 15-year operator, seller, and investor of companies operating at the intersection of media, technology, and commerce.
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Subscribe to our newsletter. We explore the intersection of next-generation media, technology, and commerce: sign-up link
Learn more about our market research and executive advisory: RockWater website
Connect with the host, Chris Erwin: LinkedIn
Follow The Come Up on Twitter: @TCUpod
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