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A weekly conversation exploring China's economy and tech scene. Guests include a wide range of policy analysts, business professionals, journalists, and academics. Hosted by Jordan Schneider and published on Lawfare.
4 days ago
How Abe Reshaped Japan
Abe Shinzo is second only to Xi as the most consequential East Asian politician of the 21st century. Tobias Harris of the Center for American Progress joins to discuss his new biography of Abe, The Iconoclast. Tobias and I discuss * His dramatic rise, fall, and rise again to power * How he reshaped governance in Japan through bureaucratic reform * How he managed relations with the US and China * How tasty his wife's Izakaya is Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro Music: あそびたりない by Pop Art Town https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icqfJx_0_W0&list=PL0Lwt5eNBHLmL8zP03KbqekrRbje8FCbu&index=92
1 hr 17 min
Jul 19, 2021
Tough Tech, Roombas, Valleys of Death, and Woolly Mammoths
How do Roombas illustrate the promise and peril of translational research? Which valley of death is really the worst valley of death? And how can woolly mammoths save the planet from climate change? To discuss, I have on: * Andrew Sosanya, Policy Analyst for the Day One Project * Adam Marblestone of Schmidt Futures (his policy proposal: https://www.dayoneproject.org/post/focused-research-organizations-to-accelerate-science-technology-and-medicine, his blog https://longitudinal.blog/, geo-engineering https://longitudinal.blog/co2-series-part-3-other-interventions/) * Orin Hoffman at The Engine (his policy proposal: https://www.engine.xyz/news-item/a-unified-government-vc-approach-to-crossing-the-valleys-of-death/) Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIh4GFUKaSE
Jul 15, 2021
Labs over Fabs: Why the US and EU Should Invest in the Future of Semiconductors
Chris Miller of Tufts and I discuss our report Labs over Fabs, our case for the US to be spending money more broadly than currently conceived by the CHIPS act. (https://chinatalk.substack.com/p/labs-over-fabs-risc-vs-promise) Please consider supporting ChinaTalk! https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ JP Kleinhans (@JPKleinhans) joins to cohost and discuss his April 2021 report that argues it's dumb for Europe to drop billions on some shiny new fabs. https://www.stiftung-nv.de/sites/default/files/eu-semiconductor-manufacturing.april_.2021.pdf The BIS filings we were talking about: https://www.regulations.gov/document/BIS-2021-0011-0001/comment Outtro music: Masiwei of Higher Brothers' Dark Horse sessions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qymY1YezhTY
Jul 10, 2021
Xi: Failed Reformer?
Why does Xi govern like he's running out of time? Rhodium's Dan Rosen and CSIS' Jude Blanchette discuss their recent Foreign Affairs pieces recapping the past years of Xi's rule from an economic and political perspective. We get into failed financial liberalization, anti-corruption, the prospects for war over Taiwan, lessons from Sputnik, and vertical farming. Dan's FA piece: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/china/2021-06-22/chinas-economic-reckoning Jude's FA Piece: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/china/2021-06-22/xis-gamble Outtro music (for my money the best propaganda song ever rapped!) PG One 破晓 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5JKHP0DtNc
Jul 7, 2021
China's Solar Industry
How did Chinese firms come to dominate the global solar industry? Now that the Biden administration has banned imports for some key components of solar panels made in Xinjiang, how will global solar buyers adapt? Andy Klump, CEO of Clean Energy Associates, a firm tasked with monitoring Chinese solar supply chains, joins the podcast to discuss. Outtro Music: 星球坠落（FALLING）by 艾热, a rapper from Xinjiang https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iN8lxL1gvOE&list=OLAK5uy_mxe6tOdJnF3FcOOYFaBPPW2wKbrE7mKwU&index=2
Jul 1, 2021
Larry Summers on China
Is China different? Does secular stagnation apply? How have Chinese economic policymakers changed over time? Should industrial policy be a thing? What should American academia navigate its relationship with China? To discuss, ChinaTalk welcomes its first former cabinet secretary to the show! Larry Summers is a professor at Harvard, who previously served as Clinton’s Secretary of the Treasury and Obama’s NEC Director. Cohosting with me is Logan Wright, Director for China Markets Research at Rhodium. Outtro Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FNtQth4yX4
Jun 27, 2021
After Xi: How Past CCP Successions Can Teach Us What Happens Next
Xi Jinping will not rule China forever. What have CCP leadership transitions looked like in the past, and what can we expect when Xi exits stage left? To discuss we have today Richard McGregor, an Aussie journalist with decades of experience in East Asia and author of three absolutely mandatory China books The Party, Asia’s Reckoning, and Xi: The Backlash, and Peter Vanderslice, a recent college grad who just wrote a fantastic thesis on CCP leadership transitions. I'm hiring a new editor for ChinaTalk! Please apply at: https://forms.gle/NNmY2vpm1fXibGYP7 Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ so I can pay said editor! Richard's report on Xi transition: https://www.csis.org/analysis/after-xi-future-scenarios-leadership-succession-post-xi-jinping-era Peter's favorite Liu Shoaqi speeches: https://file.io/ODncJdbhCC7d Outtro Songs: Whitesnake: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyF8RHM1OCg Moody Blues: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2L3UzM_FfE Rosemary Clooney: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGeMWB41maM
Jun 19, 2021
China's Cyber Strengths + How to Analyze Policy
Dave Aitel, who started his career at NSA and spent the past twenty years in offensive cybersecurity, comes on ChinaTalk to discuss * What he's learned in his quest to read every cyber policy paper * What blindspots remain in the field * How China ranks in offensive and defensive cyber ceapabilities relative to the US and what we can all learn from the Tianfu Cup (http://www.tianfucup.com/) * Why Cyberpunk 2077 is a masterpiece Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Apply to be an intern at Rhodium! https://rhg.com/careers/ Graded China Policy Papers: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1D88loPVPBgGYj53lroS05rB1LJ2kA5DnbfRJIXghST0/edit?usp=sharing Graded Cyber Policy Papers: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pnISykZe1nn1wwWBJRiaxYaqDoj4ADeBtsoUL41Hw2Y/edit?usp=sharing Outtro Music: ICE-PROUD 🏴 🏴 🏴 CAPITALIST-ZIBENJIA feat. 李尔新- & FendigheeRicch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NFP2r6TcMU
Jun 9, 2021
DARPA and How to R&D Right
Ben Reinhardt, an independent researcher and robotics PhD, discusses * Why DARPA has so many hits to its name * Why NASA wasted the past two decades * What needs to be subtracted from the US research ecosystem * Sci-fi book recommendations Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Intro Music: Mura Masa, Messy Love https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwXuBAd7Hh4 Outtro Music: 贝贝 / Melo - backbone https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26EDDCQcPEQ
Jun 4, 2021
In-Q-Tel on Chips, CFIUS, and The Valley of Death
Dr. Yan Zheng, senior technical staff specializing in microelectronics at In-Q-Tel, discusses * What it's like to invest in startups for the CIA and the rest of the US intelligence community * What's broken in the early stage chip ecosystem and how to fix it * Why the US government should consider expanding its direct investments in hard tech companies * How the US needs to counterbalance CFIUS with carrots * How anti-Asian violence has influenced the research community Please consider supporting ChinaTalk! https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro music: ICE - 随便玩玩 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RIS09dQjSQ
May 29, 2021
How to Solve America's R&D Bottlenecks
Bell Labs is dead, long live Bell Labs! This week's guest, Ilan Gur, the CEO of Activate.org, has a plan to improve America's R&D apparatus: fund start-ups that allow entrepreneurial researchers to pursue the practical applications of their world-class basic research. We discuss why we're lucky to have Moderna and BioNTech (beyond the obvious reasons), the impact of research moving from corporations to universities, the Endless Frontier Act, why patents don't equal innovation, and more. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at glow.fm/chinatalk Outtro Music: עטר מיינר - זמן לדיכאון : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwSj4egHxvE (god that violin) Peled - Sababa 5 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1Pe0Gxbx5c טדי נגוסה ויסמין מועלם - Teddy Neguse: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajN_M2k_STM&t=98s Photo of Bell Labs, abandoned.
May 20, 2021
Emergency Pod! Endless Frontier Act Butchered!
The Endless Frontier Act, the most important piece of legislation no one's heard of, got blown to bits in committee this week. Sam Hammond of the Niskanen Center joins to discuss. My recent coverage in the ChinaTalk newsletter https://chinatalk.substack.com/p/endless-frontier-the-most-important Sam's coverage: https://www.niskanencenter.org/how-congress-ruined-the-endless-frontier-act/ Outtro Music: Live As You Like by (my new favorite artist) Takayan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85NA-prJZJE
May 19, 2021
How Beijing Sees Korea
Why hasn’t North Korea emulated Deng’s Opening & Reform? Are China’s wealthy, educated, urbane youth liberals? Could the PLA cooperate with the U.S. military in the event of Korean reunification? Dr. Sungmin Cho of the Asia-Pacific Center for Security Studies joins ChinaTalk for a discussion of the Korean Peninsula as viewed by Beijing. This episode is a companion to this week’s ChinaTalk with Odd Arne Westad. Ainikki Riikonen, a research assistant at Center for a New American Security, joins as today’s co-host. Thanks to CNAS for sponsoring this episode. Read Dr. Cho’s recent article on the joint recovery of fallen soldiers on the Korean Peninsula as a “guardrail to prevent the worsening of” any potential military crisis in the region: https://apcss.org/nexus_articles/the-joint-recovery-of-fallen-soldiers-from-the-korean-war-one-way-for-american-chinese-north-and-south-korean-soldiers-to-cooperate-and-reconcile/ Outtro Music: Dean - D (Half Moon) ft. Gaeko https:…
May 16, 2021
600 Years Of Sino-Korean Relations
Odd Arne Westad joins ChinaTalk to discuss his latest book Empire and Righteous Nation: 600 Years of China-Korea Relations. Westad’s work is a diplomat’s handbook that connects the sweeping currents of history to the geopolitics of today. Co-hosting today is Danny Crichton of Techcrunch. We explore how Korea, past and present, navigates its relationship with the powerful empires on its doorstep. Korea’s unique Confucianism serves as a launching point into a discussion on empire and nation-state that takes us from the Joseon Dynasty’s navigation of the Ming Dynasty’s collapse all the way up to the present day (with snippets on espionage in Qing China, Korea’s own version of the Taiping Rebellion, and Japanese imperialism). We end on K-drama’s popularity in Zhongnanhai and how the flow of South Korean pop culture into China might complicate Chinese leaders’ decision to intervene on behalf of the DPRK in a conflict on the peninsula. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk…
May 13, 2021
Industrial Policy: How the Green New Deal's Architects Would Do IP
For Part Three of ChinaTalk's industrial policy series, we are joined by two leading lights of the American left: Saikat Chakrabarti, AOC's former Chief of Staff, and Zack Exley of the 2016 Bernie campaign. (Don't forget to check out Part One with Rob Atkinson and Part Two with José Fernandez.) Co-hosting is Vishnu Kannan, a junior fellow in Carnegie's Technology and International Affairs Program. Saikat and Zack take us inside the creation of the Green New Deal, lay out how bold leadership can change a nation's economic trajectory, lament Democrats' lukewarm appetite for industrial policy, and offer up their vision for an American developmental program that harnesses the full potential of its people and capital. We discuss everything from how Harvard teaches economics wrong to what CIA Director Bill Burn's declassified Iraq War cables have to do with the classic film Casablanca. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro music: https://youtu.be/DuVJ…
1 hr 26 min
May 10, 2021
Elon Musk, TSMC, Open Source, Endless Frontier and Zhang Yiming
Kevin Xu of the fantastic Interconnected newsletter, and formerly of Commerce and the Obama White House, ran through a grab bag of some of the hottest topics in US-China tech. We got into the politics of Tesla in China, what Morris Chang of TSMC thinks about the future of the semiconductor industry, how open source is key to the future of American industrial policy, why the Endless Frontier Act (which I wrote about in the most recent edition of the ChinaTalk newsletter) is the most important bill you've never heard of, and why Bytedance's Zhang Yiming deserves his own biopic. Student Research Symposium: https://forms.gle/FYoSeHS7t3ZLLwEh9 Work with me! https://rhg.com/job/research-assistant-china-technology-and-industry-research/ Outtro Music: Soft Lipa - An Epic | Warrior OST https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gAOTdpEeZ6s
May 6, 2021
Can China Win a War Over Taiwan? Plus Eve Online
Student Research Symposium: https://forms.gle/FYoSeHS7t3ZLLwEh9 Work with me! https://rhg.com/job/research-assistant-china-technology-and-industry-research/ Thomas Shugart joined me and Eric Lofgren on another cross-over episode of ChinaAcquisitionTalk. Thomas spent 25 years in the US Navy and is currently an adjunct senior fellow at CNAS. This possibility is made more dangerous considering the rise of China’s military, particularly in long-range missiles, bombers, and navy. The expansion of the PLA Navy over the last five years as been nearly identical to the legendary 1980s Reagan build-up. “For all the talk of them being next generation swarming and unmanned,” Thomas said, “they sure are bending a lot of iron building ships.” You can find some of Tom's writing on his CNAS page, including his War on the Rocks article, All about EVE: What virtual forever wars can teach us about the future of combat. His statement to the US-China economic and security review commission i…
May 1, 2021
China's Anti-Monopoly Moment
Fascinated (or stunned) by China’s recent anti-monopoly moves against tech giants Ant and Meituan? Want to get inside the head of Chinese regulators as they plan their moves against the globe’s largest corporations? ChinaTalk has you covered. This week I’m joined by Dr. Angela Zhang, a professor at The University of Hong Kong’s Faculty of Law, to discuss her new book “Chinese Antitrust Exceptionalism: How The Rise of China Challenges Global Regulation”. Yvonne Yu, my colleague at Rhodium, cohosts. Together we dig deep into the past, present, and future of the Chinese regulatory state. Dr. Zhang tweets at @AngelaZhangHK and you can read her work in Nikkei Asia as well: https://asia.nikkei.com/Opinion/China-s-Alibaba-probe-is-not-all-bad-news Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro Music: 艾志恒Asen - 错意 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jV1aEYpeteM
Apr 26, 2021
China's Booming Podcast Ecosystem
Enzo Chen, author of the Substack 推播助栏The Podcast Pick, and Caiwei Chen, the host of 定向跳转 The Redirect Podcast and the superb newsletter Chaoyang Trap, discuss all things podcasting in China and Taiwan. We get into the best Chinese-language shows, what makes China's leading podcast app so special, the demographics of podcast listeners, censors efforts to control the newly popular medium, and Jordan's auditory forays into classic Chinese literature. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro music: PGONE X H3R3 都是你 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLe3ksDaX1k
Apr 20, 2021
Why Are Chinese TV Dramas So Bad?
What as the rise of streaming, idols, and increased censorship done to Chinese TV? Co-hosting is Ina Yang, one of the founders of the Chinese-language podcast Loud Murmurs. We discuss Chinese dramas with AvenueX, the intrepid YouTuber who has an encyclopedic knowledge of the Chinese TV scene. AvenueX explains how the internet changed Chinese dramas (and not always for the better), why China’s censorship system leads to stilted plots (it’s not quite what you’d think), and why Zi Jinchen is the luckiest novelist in China (it’s not his books that made him famous) We also discuss our favorite shows of the past year, and our recommendations for those looking to get started in the world of C-dramas. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Links: The bad kids eng sub: https://www.iq.com/play/2ffkwrzp4tg The Long Night eng subs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqODiKTH8a4 Minning Town eng subs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8dv_IepPWg Outtro Music:…
Apr 17, 2021
How Huarong Explains China's Creaky Financial System
What is Huarong and why do its struggles explain the central contradictions of China's financial system? To discuss, Logan Wright of Rhodium joins the show. In the first ten minutes, Logan catches us up on the news of the week. Then in the following hour, I rerun an episode we recorded together in late 2018 discussing his report Credit and Credibility, which explains why the big one hasn't hit yet. Want to get in touch? We can be reached at email@example.com Outtro music: Miraie & Milkoi 『 ミユキ 』https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e66NfKGjRY
1 hr 14 min
Apr 14, 2021
Bo Xilai and How Xi Learned from the Chongqing Model
What was the Chongqing Model and why does it still matter? Yueran Zhang, a PhD student in sociology at the University of California, Berkeley, discusses. We talk about how Bo Xilai utilized mass mobilization against his enemies in the central government and China’s labor movements, and the significance of the 2018 Jasic protests. Zhang’s two recent articles for Made In China journal, “The Chongqing Model One Decade On” and “Leninists in a Chinese Factory: Reflections on the Jasic Labour Organizing Strategy,” serve as the basis for today’s episode. Outtro music: some pro-Bo Xilai song written in 2009 to commemorate him taking on gangs (full story here: https://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%96%84%E7%86%99%E6%9D%A5%E4%B9%8B%E6%AD%8C) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND6fOAR4MWA While this song is hilarious, I couldn't find a good recording and didn't want to you have to listen to the whole thing. Also thought it would be funny to pair this with folks who idolize gangsters...…
Apr 9, 2021
'Invisible China': How the Urban-Rural Divide Threatens China’s Rise
Scott Rozelle (legend, Stanford professor, co-director of the Stanford Center on China's Economy and Institutions) joins ChinaTalk to discuss his recent book Invisible China: How the Urban-Rural Divide Threatens China’s Rise, co-authored with Natalie Hell. We discuss how China’s 900 million-strong low-income population will decide China’s future development path. Is China is the next Mexico? Why is it easy to solve poverty but not low income? Why don’t local governments spend enough on rural education and health? How has the relationship between academia and government changed from the Hu Jintao-era to the Xi Jinping-era? The views expressed in this podcast are my own and do not represent those of the Rhodium Group. Outtro music: 刘思鉴 x 李佳隆 JELLORIO - "纸上谈兵" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44nfbyjzkMg Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/
Apr 4, 2021
Japan's China Challenge
To discuss, ChinaTalk assembled two of my favorite Japanese think-tankers, Yuka Koshino, a Research Fellow at the UK think tank International Institute for Strategic Studies (IISS), and Akira Igata, the Executive Director at the Tama University-affiliated Center for Rule-making Strategy (CRS). Joshua Fitt of The Center for a New American Security cohosts. Thanks to CNAS for making this show possible. Outtro songs: Takayan, What’s the meaning of living: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGDQQnBVUsk Hideyoshi, Majinahanashi: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9a3sPzbG68I You heard it here first, Takayan's gonna be huge. And if for whatever reason you want to get depressed listening to AR's propaganda rap: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmAkYGQXv5Q Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/
Apr 1, 2021
Derek Sandhaus is the author of Drunk in China: Baijiu and the World's Oldest Drinking Culture and part of the team behind Ming River Baijiu, the first (good) Baijiu created especially for the international market. We discuss AA in china, Baijiu's origins, different varieties of Baijiu, the drink's evolving role in modern China, as well as the challenge of bringing such a polarizing drink to Europe and the US. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro music: Hiperson, Spring Breeze https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHe1OrbuW5g&list=PL0Lwt5eNBHLmL8zP03KbqekrRbje8FCbu&index=48
Mar 29, 2021
US-China Ideological Competition
Are the US and China in ideological competition? How does one go about answering that question? Dan Tobin of the US Intelligence Community's National Intelligence University and Ryan Manuel of Official China have a dangerous amount of fun debating guiding ideologies and what they mean for geopolitics. Dan's 2020 congressional testimony on CCP ideology: https://www.uscc.gov/sites/default/files/testimonies/SFR%20for%20USCC%20TobinD%2020200313.pdf Ryan's PhD thesis on CCP bureaucracy (which really is fantastic, chapter 3 is an absolute must-read): https://ora.ox.ac.uk/objects/uuid:84ec884b-9bd7-46d7-a395-f6bf9ba501e0/download_file?safe_filename=RManuel%2BDPhil%2BFINAL.pdf&file_format=application%2Fpdf&type_of_work=Thesis This episode was recorded in late 2020. Dan's views are his own and do not reflect those of the US Government or the NIU. The only way I can hope to keep up this two-show/week pace is to pay my fantastic editors to clean up these episodes for you all. Please conside…
1 hr 27 min
Mar 26, 2021
China's Chip Dreams
John Verwey of the Substack “Semi-Literate" (and formerly of Commerce’s BIS, USITC, and USTR) talks the history and future of China's chip industry. We get into government guidance funds, the CHIPS Act, “Fabs not Labs,” export controls, and more. John's substack: https://semiliterate.substack.com/ Outtro Music: Justice‘s Genesis (Live Version) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdsEaSx7u90
Mar 23, 2021
Michèle Flournoy on "Affecting the Strategic Calculus"
Michèle Flournoy joined AcquisitionTalk's Eric Lofgren and me for another crossover episode of China-AcquisitionTalk. Flournoy is a former Undersecretary of Defense for Policy, co-founder and new board chair of CNAS (where I'm a fellow), and currently the founder and managing partner of WestExec Advisors. I dove deep into the archive, digging up copies of Flournoy's undergraduate and master's theses to discuss "psycho-social approaches to international relations" and 1980s nuclear policy. We also covered: * China’s approach to systems destruction warfare * How to make a compelling case for technologists to join DoD * Nuclear policy and affecting the strategic calculus * Whether “legacy” weapons need divestment * A “Manhattan Project” for AI/ML Please consider supporting ChinaTalk https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro music: O.WEN《官方回答》 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXT3zITsydQ The views expressed in this podcast do not reflect those of the Rhodium G…
Mar 20, 2021
Te-Ping Chen's Short Stories of Modern China
In her years as a Wall Street Journal foreign correspondent in Hong Kong and Beijing, Te-Ping Chen came across a lifetime of remarkable characters and events. Most of these didn’t make her newspaper articles, so she began collecting them in short stories, which were collected in a book published just last month, Land of Big Numbers. Mara Hvistendahl guest hosts an interview with Te-Ping, where we discuss her writing process, journalism versus fiction writing, and some of the stories behind the stories. Outtro Music: Pocketful of Stars - Shanghai Rainbow Chambers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ui3z7-1rUYI&t=1s "For those people sometimes cannot be understood well by others but still have strong willingness to be understood. Surely, we can also regard that the song is written for everyone. We truly believe that we all have our own zone where we place our little secrets and childlike thoughts and we wish all the goodliness in hearts can sparkle permanently like twinkling stars in t…
Mar 16, 2021
Rhodium's Dan Rosen on Hiring Me, 30 Years of China-Watching, Decoupling, and Debt
Dan Rosen is the founding partner of the Rhodium Group and leads the China team. He is also my boss! We talk about our plans for China tech coverage, lessons from thirty years of China-watching, how he thinks about decoupling, China's debt situation. We also play underrated/overrated on whether track two dialogues are a waste of time, PDF length, and talking to government officials. Want to work with me? Please get in touch at firstname.lastname@example.org. Outtro Music: YTH Chopie ft YOUNG13DBABY -《Best Friend》 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwDu2VScBW0
Mar 13, 2021
To The Quad! The Origins of "Indo-Pacific"
Rory Medcalf, head of the National Security College at Australia National University discusses his new book 'Indo-Pacific Empire.' We talk 15th-century Korean maps, the promise of the 1947 Asian Relations Conference, Australia and India's shifting conceptions of their place in the region, the origins of the Quad, China-Australia relations, and advice Rory has for the Quad countries as they try to figure out what this 'minilateral' should amount to. Megan Lamberth of CNAS cohosts. Also discussed is Martijn Rasser's report on Tech, Australia and the Quad (https://www.cnas.org/publications/reports/networked-techno-democratic-statecraft-for-australia-and-the-quad). Thanks to CNAS for sponsoring this episode. Outtro music, perhaps the most beautiful song featured on ChinaTalk, comes to us via Rory's suggestion. His intro: "Bayini, by Australian indigenous singer Gurrumul (who sadly is no longer with us). Gurrumul performed in New Delhi in 2012 alongside Anoushka Shankar in a concert…
Mar 10, 2021
Adam Tooze and Matt Klein Return!
Adam Tooze (now on Substack!) and Matt Klein, author of Trade Wars Are Class Wars, return to ChinaTalk and pick up right where they left off in September. We discuss whether Ricardo’s theories of comparative advantage actually work in a globalized age, why Stalin’s embrace of “socialism in one country” was a response to the hegemonic power of British (and American) capital, whether a Bolshevik Revolution is the best way to solve global inequality, how intra-elite conflict drives sovereignty-limiting engagement in international organizations, vaccines, Europe’s carbon markets, Keynes' "bancor", the Strategic Shiraz Reserve, and a whole lot more. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro: 大傻 Damnshine【天才病】https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu-RNICSIec
Mar 4, 2021
Clubhouse and Feminism in China with Shen Lu
Shen Lu of Protocol discusses the magical world of Mandarin language Clubhouse before diving into the feminist movement in China. We cover the Xianzi case, Bilibili's misogynist content, and the challenges that women face working in China's highest-flying tech firms. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at glow.fm/chinatalk Outtro Music: 賽文&GOD - 努力工作吧 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYSncvx4txE We mentioned https://www.freshgogo.com/ and https://www.yamibuy.com/en as Chinese grocery delivery options in the show. https://www.hungrypanda.co/ is the 'seamless' for Asian food, which also in 10 different countries! They really should sponsor me...
Feb 27, 2021
故事FM (China's "This American Life") Founder Talks Storytelling in Modern China
Aizhe, 故事FM's founder, runs the leading Chinese language podcast. His show gives a platform for everyday Chinese to tell their stories. We talked about his show and the state of journalism in modern China. Aizhe is a personal hero of mine and I'm so grateful I had this opportunity to record this episode. Aizhe would love to get in touch with American podcast producers, so if you are one, please don't be shy. Reach out to me and I'll put you in touch! Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk Outtro music: Haze by OBO3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abjvaYqMUw4
Feb 25, 2021
Beyond Espionage: China's Quest for Foreign Technology
Four contributors to the recent book China's Quest for Foreign Technology: Beyond Espionage discuss China’s foreign technology acquisition. Is it nefarious, or just typical behavior of an upwardly mobile nation? Is the myth of a stateless global society dead? And why does such a pressing issue seem invisible in the West? Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk Outtro music: AR [for my money the hottest lyricist in the game] - ABC (feat Buzzy, Cee) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_polATUel0
Feb 16, 2021
Rethinking Industrial Policy...and Everything Else
I have a newsletter! If you listen to this podcast I can say with high confidence you'll enjoy it! Do subscribe at https://chinatalk.substack.com/. Jose Luis Ricón Fernández de la Puente, an independent researcher who runs the blog nintil.com, complicates our previous week's ChinaTalk on US industrial policy with Rob Atkinson. We discuss whether the state invented the iPhone, if the trends of history are pointing Taiwan’s direction, why the way we fund science is broken, what mass conversions to Mormonism would mean for the American economy, and, if you stick around to the end, how to live forever. This episode was brought to you by the Korea Foundation, which has sponsored a series of ChinaTalk episodes supplementing my forthcoming paper coming out next month entitled ‘Labs not Fabs: How the U.S. Should Invest in the Future of Semiconductors’. This research was hosted by the Eurasia Program at the Foreign Policy Research Institute. Outtro music: AR - ABC (feat Buzzy, Cee) h…
1 hr 16 min
Feb 11, 2021
Chinese Cooking Demystified
Chinese Cooking Demystified is my favorite English language Youtube cooking channel. I chat with creators Chris and Steph about how they create their recipes, who watches their videos, whether Chinese food is soft power, bilibili vs youtube cooking channels, and why everyone in China wants to learn to bake. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ 春节快乐！ Outtro music, Doubanjiang by Masiwei https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HxkMKb_EQs
Feb 8, 2021
Richard Fontaine on CNAS and US-China
Richard Fontaine, CEO of CNAS, discusses what it's like to run what very well may be the hottest think tank in the Asia policy game (full disclosure: I'm a CNAS adjunct). We get into Biden and Asia and how the new president's foreign policy team will prioritize what they want to get out of the US-China relationship. We also touch on the biggest argument Richard's had with current senior DoD official and former CNAS VP Ely Ratner, what he's learned from looking at China questions with Silicon Valley luminaries, why he'd like to do more faith-centered studies of foreign policy, what fiction he's reading...and if you stick around until the end of the show we get into export controls! Subscribe to https://www.thewirechina.com/ and use the code ChinaTalk21 for 25% off. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk Ad music: Oddissee https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx4FrSkuPsE Outtro music (after all the complaints about Bruce Springsteen you get two tracks this week...)…
1 hr 27 min
Jan 29, 2021
Taiwan! Pigs, Politics, and Pop Music
Maggie Lewis (Seton Hall) and Lev Nachman (UC Irvine) talk Biden's Taiwan policy, pork trade politics, the future of the KMT, third parties, academic freedom, gay marriage, and asylum from Hong Kong. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk Outtro Music: ABAO阿爆（阿仍仍)【Kinakaian 母親的舌頭】feat. 林宜瑾, 丁立芬 共創 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tsh4lMH1fA8)
Jan 22, 2021
A User's Guide to US Industrial Policy
I have a newsletter! If you listen to this podcast I can say with high confidence you'll enjoy it! Do subscribe at https://chinatalk.substack.com/. Rob Atkinson is the president of ITIF, the Information Technology and Innovation Foundation, a non-partisan DC-based think tank. We’re going to discuss US industrial policy grand strategy in light of China’s rise, what the US can expect from its allies on tech policy, as well as the “power trader” paradigm and how Albert Hirschmann’s analysis of 20th century Kaiser and Nazi trade policy helps explain China today. This episode was brought to you by the Korea Foundation, which has sponsored a series of ChinaTalk episodes supplementing my forthcoming paper coming out next month entitled ‘Labs not Fabs: How the U.S. Should Invest in the Future of Semiconductors’. This research was hosted by the Eurasia Program at the Foreign Policy Research Institute. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Outtro Mu…
1 hr 1 min
Jan 17, 2021
WWII's Legacy in China with Rana Mitter
Rana Mitter, professor of Chinese history at Oxford University, discusses his book from earlier this year, China’s Good War: How World War II Is Shaping a New Nationalism. Now seventy-five years after China’s victory over Japan, China is rethinking how it grapples with the legacy of WWII (see, for example, The Eight Hundred, the highest-grossing film of 2020, discussed towards the end of the show). Mitter argues that this growing emphasis on World War II is evidence of a subtle rewriting of history, where 1945 takes on a significance comparable to 1949, and the CCP adopts historical victories of the Kuomintang. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk Intro music: 赴戰, 'To Battle,‘ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB9TmKdo0qU&feature=youtu.be Outtro music: 大刀进行曲, or "Sword March," written in honor of the poorly armed Chinese fighters at the Marco Polo Bridge Incident. See here for more info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sword_March.
1 hr 3 min
Jan 7, 2021
Matt Brazil discusses his new book co-written with Peter Mattis, 'Chinese Communist Espionage, An Intelligence Primer.' We talk about the role spies played in the creation and evolution of the CCP, run through some Zhou Enlai conspiracy theories, and discuss the role of espionage in today's China. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Intro Music: Wong Chia Chi's theme from Lust, Caution Outtro Music: Player's Ball by Outkast (Thank you Georgia!)
Jan 2, 2021
Great Power Competition with Richard Danzig
On the second joint episode of Acquisition Talk and ChinaTalk, Richard Danzig, a Secretary of the Navy under Clinton, discusses US-China relations and military innovation. Richard is a Senior Fellow at Johns Hopkins APL, a former Secretary of the Navy, and a fiction guy. We traverse a number of subjects, including: * How the risk of war with China is reflected in trade policy * The problems regulators face in high-tech industries * Views on growing the US Navy to 500 ships * How US prime contracts differ from state-owned enterprises * Whether the Chinese are more risk-tolerant than the US His book recs include: * Woman of the Dunes * The Door * The Lonely Polygamist Outtro music "LL Cool J" by Ansr J Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk
Jan 2, 2021
DIU's Michael Brown on US-China Tech Competition
Kicking off a series on US-China defense-related issues with Eric Lofgren of the podcast AcquisitionTalk, we host Defense Innovation Unit head Michael Brown. We touch on a number of topics, including: * Industrial espionage and foreign investment * The debate over basic vs. applied research * China starting to determine technical standards * Coordinating with allies on semiconductors * Transitioning tech in the DoD Before taking the helm of DIU in 2018, Michael co-authored a study with Pravneet Singh showing how Chinese participation in the US venture/tech ecosystem had surged from $300 million in 2010 to $11.52 billion in 2015. Chinese capital comprised 16 percent of all deals in 2016. That work launched the Foreign Investment Risk Review Modernization Act (FIRRMA) which strengthened the government's ability to block Chinese investments. Do note we recorded this episode in early Nov before the election. Outtro music by Higher Brothers, 'Empire' Please consider supporti…
Dec 26, 2020
KFC, The Toilet Revolution, and the Business of Propaganda
Why is KFC so big in China? What is the “Toilet Revolution” and why does it matter? How does Chinese propaganda work? How have bicycles’ role in Chinese society evolved over time? Neil Thomas of MacroPolo takes on this grab bag. Note this is a rebroadcast from November 2018. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at glow.fm/chinatalk. Outtro music is a KFC vs McDonalds rap battle.
1 hr 5 min
Dec 22, 2020
Chinese Hip Hop in 2020 Radio Show
Duoduodiliao walks us through his favorite Chinese rap songs of 2020, taking us everywhere from soul rap and R&B to drill and Caribbean-inspired beats. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at www.glow.fm/chinatalk Songs in order played in the show, all available on YouTube PO8 - 霓虹 李爾新 lil shin《CN DRILL》官方微博完整版 慕斯塔法 / JELLORIO 李佳隆 - Falling 八口8uck/KnowKnow -《Map》 Lexie Liu 刘柏辛 - 佳人 "站着亲吻子弹"艾热派克特组淘汰Athree后，发作品《Punch》发表感想《说唱听我的》 艾福杰尼 - 葡萄架下的篝火
Dec 17, 2020
America's New Tools of Coercion
Peter Harrell and Liz Rosenberg, both CNAS fellows, joined ChinaTalk in May to talk about their report authored with Ashley Fung, 'A New Arsenal for Competition: Coercive Economic Measures in the U.S.-China Relationship.' We discuss how the Trump administration has refined the use of these policy tools since Liz and Peter served under Obama, do a round overrated/underrated for international economic policy tools, and hear their best tv pilot pitches with sanctions themes. Please consider contributing to ChinaTalk at glow.fm/chinatalk. Your support makes this show possible. Music is some pro-Putin, anti-US sanctions song that has an awful ratio on youtube.
1 hr 1 min
Dec 12, 2020
Wendy Cutler on US-China Trade Policy
Wendy Culter, who served 28 years in the Office of the US Trade Representative, discusses how Biden should address Beijing on trade. We talk about how he could leverage allies' frustration with Chinese behavior and speculate about the future of the WTO. We also debate the merits of a number of my hair-brained trade ideas including the Strategic Shiraz Reserve and a Mutual Trade Defense Pact. If ChinaTalk is worth $1 an episode to you, please consider becoming a supporter of ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ I spelled out my trade policy ideas in more detail in my newsletter here. https://chinatalk.substack.com/p/a-strategic-shiraz-reserve-to-help Music by Indigo Jam Unit and the 1896 William Jennings Bryan campaign!
Dec 8, 2020
Blockchain Chicken Farm: How Tech Changed Rural China
Xiaowei Wang discusses her new book. She explores Taobao villages where Snow White Halloween costumes get made, how one police station is sputtering towards digitization, parallels between Silicon Valley and Chinese tech culture, and pearl farming #distrupt. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk Pick up a Smart Air Filter for the holidays (https://smartairfilters.com/) and be sure to use the promo code 'ChinaTalk' for a 5% discount. Music by Collage and Mondo Grosso
Dec 4, 2020
How to Research China, Talent Programs, and Military-Civil Fusion
Emily Weinstein of CSET talks open source China research. We also sort truth from fact and fiction on Chinese talent programs and MCF. Buy an air filter at https://smartairfilters.com/ and use the code 'ChinaTalk' for a discount! Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/. Music by Nujabes and 珂拉琪 Collage
Dec 2, 2020
The Blunder Down Under? How China-Australia Relations Fell Off a Cliff
Yun Jiang walks step by step through the past three years of deteriorating Australia-China relations. I haven't sold an ad this calendar year. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk financially: https://glow.fm/chinatalk Music by Taiwanese-Australian artist Kim Yang, song entitled Garden of Eden is about the brushfires. For more, check out her website at www.kimyangmusic.com Photo of Xi in 2014 in Tasmania receiving a lavender bear.
Nov 27, 2020
5G in the Caribbean, Open Source Tech, CCP Twitter Bots, Chinese TV and Rap
I chatted this week with Rasheed Griffith of the China in the Caribbean Podcast. I highly recommend you check out his channel! We discuss: * The possible future of US-China tech competition under the incoming Biden Administration * The nature of China's Twitter influence campaigns and what we can learn about making viral memes from Russian disinformation operators. See here for my deep dive. * Why open-source software should be the basis for a new US industrial policy and why China is looking to push that same strategy * What we can learn from good Chinese tv shows * Why we should all be listening to Chinese rap Recommendations: Jordan * American Mandarin Society 'China Syllabi Project' * 隐秘的角落 (Chinese TV show about the drama that ensues after a group of young kids accidentally film a murder.) * 令人心动的offer (Chinese reality show about legal interns. Season 2 is particularly recommended.) * 棋魂 (Chinese TV drama about a Fairy godfather…
Nov 24, 2020
Incoming NSA Jake Sullivan on an Alternative Vision for US-China Relations
President-Elect Joe Biden just tapped Jake Sullivan to serve as his first National Security Advisor, the most important foreign policy role in the White House. In light of this announcement, I'm rerunning an episode we recorded in late 2019. Jake Sullivan previously served in the Obama administration as National Security Advisor to Vice President Joe Biden and Director of Policy Planning at the U.S. State Department. Check out my newsletter at https://chinatalk.substack.com/. In the most recent edition, I do a deep dive comparing the HR McMaster and Sullivan interviews. Do consider supporting this show at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ if you're enjoying the two episode/week pace I'm currently keeping up. Outtro music by Kafe.Hu
Nov 21, 2020
HR McMaster on His Time as NSA, China, and History's Role in Policymaking
HR McMaster was Trump's National Security Advisor and, it seems, a ChinaTalk superfan. We talk about his time in government, what the US missed about China and what to do about it, and which Seinfeld character would make the best NSA. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Sign up for the weekly ChinaTalk newsletter at https://chinatalk.substack.com/
Nov 16, 2020
Biden's Foreign Policy
What will a Biden administration foreign policy look like? What’s going to happen on tech and trade? How will debates within the democratic party on what to do about china shake out? Where will congress be on the issue? How will Biden the man impact foreign policy? To discuss, we have on the person who has taught me most about American politics, David F. Gordon, currently a senior advisor at IISS. Previously, he was my boss at the Eurasia Group, served as the director of policy planning under Condoleezza Rice at the State Department, acting chairman of the National Intelligence Council, among many other positions in a multi-decade career in the IC. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/
Nov 12, 2020
Is a Chinese Financial Crisis Looming?
The Chinese economy is perhaps the world's only economic bright spot. So that means we can stop worrying about a financial crisis, right? Think again, according to Lauren Gloudeman and Logan Wright of the Rhodium Group, who join to discuss their new paper mapping out the weak points in China's financial system. That this report is a follow-up to Logan's 2018 paper entitled Credit and Credibility. Our past show on the topic you can find here on Apple Podcasts and here on Spotify. Cohosting is Byrne Hobart of the diff newsletter. If you appreciate the fact that I've been doing two shows a week this month, please consider supporting ChinaTalk financially at https://glow.fm/chinatalk
Nov 8, 2020
David Feng talks Chinese trains and subways. We get into the history and evolution of China's trains, the impact of industrial policy, and the role of foreign technology. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk.
Nov 8, 2020
Swing State Appreciation Hip Hop Minimix
A thank you to everyone out there who helped make yesterday possible. "With full hearts and steady hands, with faith in America and in each other, with a love of country — and a thirst for justice — let us be the nation that we know we can be. A nation united. A nation strengthened. A nation healed." From Atlanta: Ray Charles, Ludacris, Killer Mike, Andre 3000, Quavo, Childish Gambino From Philly: Beanie Sigel, Lil Uzi Vert (Tried to fit in Dreams and Nightmares but the lyrics are just too offensive...) From Detroit: Eminem, Dej Loaf From Minnesota: Justin Vernon
Oct 28, 2020
What To Do About Xinjiang
How should the US respond to the human rights crisis in Xinjiang? I was a guest on the Lawfare podcast this week, discussing my recent essay outlining how the U.S. can respond and push back on the Chinese government's abuses in the region. For the first fifteen minutes, I interviewed Sheena Greitens, an associate professor at UT Austin's LBJ School of Public Affairs, on the origins of the camps and Xi's motivation for the current policy. In the second half, Lawfare editor Jacob Schulz and I discuss what the US government should do from legislative, executive and diplomatic angles. Google calendar invite to Saturday 5 pm EST zoom phonebanking. Google calendar invite to Sunday 5 pm EST zoom phonebanking. My email is email@example.com or I'm on twitter here if those links don't work for you. Thanks.
Oct 27, 2020
Why Xi Is All In On Climate Change
Xi wants China to reach peak emissions by 2030 and go carbon neutral by 2060. Why now? Can he do it? Lauri Myllyvirta comes on to discuss. RSVP for live Xinjiang discussion at 2:30pm est here. See here for my Xinjiang policy proposal. Google calendar invite to Saturday 5 pm EST zoom phonebanking. Google calendar invite to Sunday 5 pm EST zoom phonebanking. My email is firstname.lastname@example.org or I'm on twitter here if those links don't work for you. Thanks.
Oct 24, 2020
CCP Influence Ops in Japan: Everywhere Yet Nowhere in Particular
'Everywhere Yet Nowhere in Particular' is the title of Devin Stewart's latest report. We discuss China's tactics in trying to influence Japanese politics and society as well as what makes Japan uniquely resistant to the CCP's charms. Refer 10 friends to get yourself a ChinaTalk mug! I made a 20-minute megamix of Japanese city pop and trap for you all at the end! If you want the tracklist in the form of a top-secret ChinaTalk YouTube playlist, just start supporting ChinaTalk!
Oct 22, 2020
What Does US-China Corruption Really Look Like? Also, iFlyTek
Refer your friends ChinaTalk! If you get 10 people to sign up using your referral link, you'll get a free ChinaTalk mug! Mara Hvistendahl is a staff writer at The Intercept. In this bitesize edition of ChinaTalk, we discuss pieces of hers on the US Ambassador to China's son and ZTE (The Intercept) and AI voice recognition giant iFlyTek (Wired). Intro and outtro music liner notes available exclusively to ChinaTalk supporters. Become one here. And more importantly, vote.
Oct 15, 2020
China and the NBA
Why, aside from Yao, have Chinese players had no success in the NBA? Post-NBA, what has Yao done to reform and professionalize the Chinese Basketball Association? One year on, how does the NBA's response to Houston Rockets GM Daryl Morey's tweet look in retrospect, and why has the Chinese government responded so differently to NBA and Premier League stars making noise about Xinjiang? Hunter Shi of the podcast 翻转体育 and Nate Duncan of the Dunk'd On Podcast join to discuss. Please refer your friends to ChinaTalk to win a ChinaTalk mug or hand-drawn postcard of your favorite Chinese politician! Click here to get a referral code and then text your friends the show. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. I'm at email@example.com and twitter if you want to reach out. Outtro Music: I've got good news and other news. Now each ChinaTalk episode will have two outtro songs (!!), but I'll be paywalling the tracklist. If you subscribe to ChinaTalk, I'll invite you to a private YouTu…
Oct 8, 2020
China's True Tech Ambitions
How does the Chinese government's S&T spending differ fundamentally from America's and what does that tell us about the nature of their industrial policy? What is China Standards 2035 and what implications could it have? Will China pull the rare earth card? And is there any chance that America doesn't overcorrect? Emily de La Bruyere of Horizon Advisory joins ChinaTalk to discuss. Do reach out to me on twitter or at firstname.lastname@example.org. I have a newsletter! Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. Outtro Music: 0-100Records: NINEONE乃万, ICE, 刘炫廷, 新秀, Doooboi- “新人王” OFFICAL MUSIC VIDEO "THAT‘S HOW WE PLAY"
Oct 2, 2020
Liberalism: The Light That Failed
In his memoir The World as It Is, Ben Rhodes, Barack Obama’s closest national security aide, confides that, on the day Obama left the White House, the worry that haunted him most was: ‘What if we were wrong?’ That is, what if liberals had misinterpreted the nature of the post-Cold War period? ‘What if we were wrong?’ is the question Ivan Krastev and Stephen Holmes set out to explain in their recent The Light That Failed: A Reckoning, which takes Eastern Europe as exhibit A. The book meditates on how liberalism lost its appeal and its themes have clear echoes in East Asia. Guest hosting today is Eddie Fishman. Do reach out to me on twitter or at email@example.com. I have a newsletter! Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. Intro Music: HAYA乐团《迁徙》 全员战士风尝试突破 Outtro Music (thanks Stephen for the suggestion, very thematic!): Basement Tapes: Kansas City. Marcus Mumford on vocals and Johnny Depp (!) playing guitar.
1 hr 14 min
Sep 29, 2020
TikTok, WeChat and Trump
It's been a wild few weeks with President Trump threatening to shut WeChat and TikTok out of the U.S. market and rip them out of the app stores. There have been lawsuits, a preliminary injunction—and a sudden deal to purchase TikTok and moot the issue out. To chew it all over, Benjamin Wittes hosted a discussion with Lawfare co-founder Bobby Chesney, a professor at the University of Texas at Austin Law School, and me, Jordan, the voice behind ChinaTalk. We talked about how we got here, whether the threat from these companies is real or whether this is more Trump nonsense, and whether the deal to save TikTok will actually work. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. Outtro Music: 淡 水 鱼 - Yowaii & 徐奇 Feat. 袁子安
Sep 25, 2020
War in Taiwan
Why would Xi invade and is the Taiwanese military up to the challenge? Paul Huang, freelance journalist, Fletcher School grad and fellow at the Taiwanese Public Opinion Foundation joins to discuss. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk and/or offering me gainful employment! If you want to get in touch, just email at firstname.lastname@example.org or message me on twitter. Intro Music: 【青春不留白】莒光園地 (Taiwanese military broadcast music) Outtro Music: 陳嫺靜 - 輕輕 (Taiwanese R&B artist) Check out some more here: https://www.bandwagon.asia/articles/the-next-wave-of-taiwanese-hip-hop-artists
Sep 18, 2020
Adam Tooze on World Order, Then and Now
Adam Tooze is my favorite economic historian. After writing a handful of books on the 1920s and Nazi economics, he's now turned his eye to the present day, taking on the financial crisis and US-China relations. In this conversation, we get into * What we can learn from the diplomatic and economic modes of 1920s and 30s * Why Nazi legal theory resonates so well in China today * How modes of understanding Nazi Germany can help illustrate China * How Xinjiang camps echo the logic of Soviet gulags * Whether the US in fact lost the Cold War * Adam's dream bureaucracies to work it Matt Klein, author of the recent Trade Wars are Class Wars, guest hosts. Intro and outtro music are both hit songs from 1928, the year of the Kellogg-Briand Pact which tried to outlaw war. Intro music: Pine Top's Boogie Woogie Outtro music: Blind Willie McTell, Statesboro Blues Please consider supporting ChinaTalk
1 hr 16 min
Sep 10, 2020
The Mulan Debacle
Turning a beloved movie of female empowerment into a dull endorsement of the patriarchy, autocracy and mass forced labor is no easy feat, but Disney Magic is one hell of a drug. Think tanker Rui Zhong and novelist/meme goddess Xiran Jay Zhao join to discuss. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk Intro music: Reflections by Christina Aguilera (Tojou Remix) Outtro music: I'd be impressed if you made it to the end of this podcast and didn't know this song, but here's the link If you're looking for more Disney remixes, this one of the Lion King's Circle of Life is perfect.
Sep 2, 2020
Rise and Fall of a Suzhou Soft Serve Baron
(fan favorite repeat broadcast from back in the 'ChinaEconTalk' era) Mister Softee, the famed northeastern American ice cream brand, in Suzhou, China? Yes, that was a thing. Turner Sparks, rising from humble beginnings as just another English teacher making his way in the world, achieved fame and fortune thanks to a catchy jingle and some tasty mango-flavored soft serve. Yet his vision of China-wide ice cream domination dissolved amid a deluge of backstabbing regulators, slashed tires, and stolen cones. Listen here to learn about the circumstances that finally melted Turner’s ice cream dream. Athena Cao cohosts. Please Consider Supporting ChinaTalk
1 hr 6 min
Aug 26, 2020
Land Wars: China's Agrarian Revolution
In 1927, Mao wrote that "In a very short time...several hundred million peasants will rise like a mighty storm, like a hurricane, a force so swift and violent that no power, however great, will be able to hold it back." During the 40s and 50s, he was able to realize this vision to disastrous effect. On this show, Tulane Professor Brian DeMare joins the show to discuss the history and legacy of the land reform movement, including forays into the role of Xi's father and William Hinton's Fanshen. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. Also, do reach out if you're interested in running ads on the show! Intro Music: 没有共产党没有新中国 Outtro Music: 听妈妈讲过去的故事 (hip hop felt out of place this week...not to worry we'll be back with more in the next episode)
1 hr 5 min
Aug 18, 2020
Scholarstage on Xi, War in Taiwan, the CCP Toolkit, and the Chinese Tradition
Tanner Greer of the blog Scholarstage joins the show in a wide-ranging discussion touching on Xi's ideology, incentives in western China-watching, Mormons in China, why it's worth studying classical Chinese history, and AI-assisted writing. ChinaTalk has hit its 100th episode! That's two and a half full workweeks of informed, respectful, and hopefully entertaining conversation on everything China. As the media industry has cratered, spaces for intelligent and open discussion on China that live outside of paywalls basically don't exist anymore. Since COVID has locked me out of China and forced me to move to the US, my living expenses have gone up, and spending dozens of hours on this podcast is looking increasingly unsustainable. Right now, I make less than $5 an hour producing this show. If you'd like to see ChinaTalk continue to come out weekly, Please consider supporting me at glow.fm/chinatalk I'm also thinking about launching some member rewards, like live zoom, tapings of episo…
1 hr 13 min
Aug 9, 2020
What China Wants
How do you even go about answering that question? Is there a consensus in Washington on how to confront China and does that consensus make any sense? Ali Wyne and Jessica Chen Weiss come on to discuss. Currently, I make $4/hr from donations adding up all the time it takes to prep, record, and edit the show. This is the 99th episode of ChinaTalk. If you'd like to see the show continue production at the same frequency of one episode per week, please consider donating to support ChinaTalk at https://glow.fm/chinatalk. Intro music: Oddisee - Skipping Rocks Outtro music, what mumble rap sounds like in Mandarin in 2020: JelloRio 李佳隆 ：还没离开
Jul 31, 2020
Superpower Showdown: Tale of a Trade War
Lingling Wei and Bob Davis of the WSJ discuss their new book Superpower Showdown. We dive deep into the personal dynamics within the Xi and Trump administrations as well as what the twists and turns over the past few years reveal about the US-China relationship. Please consider supporting ChinaTalk. This show took me 10 hours of reading, 2 hours of script-writing, an hour of recording, and four hours of editing. Right now, I receive $50 in donations per episode, meaning my work on this podcast earns me $3/hr. I'm coming up on my 100th episode and of late have been reflecting on how much time I'm spending on something that brings in so little financially. If you have the means and would like to put ChinaTalk on more stable footing, do consider showing your support. Donate at https://glow.fm/chinatalk/ Intro music: Madlib, Distant Land Outtro music: Senior PRC official Liao Min recording back in the early 1990s during his days as a PKU grad student, 流动的青春
Jul 24, 2020
TikTok, Tesla, Kanye and Open Source
Should the US ban TikTok? What role does open source play in the tech ecosystem and the Chinese government's plans for self-reliance? Why does tech occupy such a unique role in the US-China tech cold war? And what can Kanye teach us about foreign policy? Today's guest is Kevin Xu, author of the interconnected newsletter. Click this link to support ChinaTalk. Intro Music: Kanye's Runaway. Exit Music: 2019 New Blood DBC Cypher.
Jul 17, 2020
How Sanctions Fail US Policymakers
Eddie Fishman, who worked in Obama's State Department's Policy Planning Staff, joins to discuss his recent articles on sanctions and the world order. If you know of any job opportunities (or just wanna say hi!) do reach out. I'm at Jorschneider@gmail.com or @jordanschnyc on twitter. And as always, the newsletter and Patreon! Intro music: 一丢丢 by AR Outtro music: selection from the 说唱听我的 cypher
Jul 10, 2020
How Corruption Works in China
How can China be so corrupt and yet grow so fast? What's the relationship between corruption and competent governance? How does 'access money' at the higher levels differ from the 'profit-sharing' you see lower down in the bureaucracy? How does China in the 21st century compare with America's gilded age? And why won't anyone give me dinosaur eggs? To discuss, Prof. Yuen Yuen Ang joins the show to talk about her fantastic new book, China's Gilded Age. Please subscribe to my Patreon! Or better yet, a full-time job offer as your humble host is very much unemployed! Patreon will suffice though. The incredible propaganda rap song feat. Xi Jinping here. And the best Chinese tv show of the decade.
1 hr 4 min
Jun 26, 2020
The H1B Ban and National Security
This week Trump banned valid H1B holders from entering the country. What are the broader implications for America's technological ecosystem and national security? To discuss, Tina Huang and Remco Zwetsloot from CSET talk about their recent research on tech and immigration. We discuss the potential lasting impacts of the, for now, temporary ban, how the US immigration process compares to other nations' policies, what China is doing to bolster their homegrown talent as well as the threat of corporate espionage. Please consider donating to the ChinaTalk Patreon. Here is the paper I mentioned on corporate espionage. See here for the CSET research discussed. Intro Music: 胜利就在前方了 by KaKa. Outtro Music: Hamilton Mixtape, Immigrants, We Get the Job Done
Jun 24, 2020
China-India Clashes: What Happens Next?
On June 15th, dozens of soldiers died in clashes on the China-India border. What exactly happened up in the Himalayas? What's the historical background? What does this mean for the trajectory of China-India and US-India relations? We also get into development policy, water rights, and some improv featuring terrible Trump and Modi accents (I didn't even try when doing Xi). Thanks to Akhil Bery and Sasha Riser Kositsky for coming on the show. Please consider donating to the ChinaTalk Patreon.
Jun 17, 2020
Hong Kong's Protests One Year On
This week’s ChinaTalk featured Antony Dapiran going deep with me on the origin, meaning, and legacy of the 2019 Hong Kong protests. We drew parallels and contrasts throughout between HK and Black Lives Matter. If you'd like to help keep the show going, please consider subscribing to my Patreon. An excerpt: What continues to be most tragic for Hong Kong is that the government really has demonized and made enemies of the people who support the protesters and the protesters themselves. Indeed, Carrie Lam, herself has described them as enemies of the people just yesterday. And so the government has made an enemy of an entire generation of its youth and also the engine of its service-led economy, the professional middle class. It’s obviously against the economic self-interest of Hong Kong, but also it's just a tragedy for a government, to divide its own community in that way and to treat the best and brightest of the community as enemies, effectively forcing them either to leave o…
1 hr 18 min
Jun 8, 2020
Evan Osnos on Tiananmen, Protests in America and Political Leadership
Evan Osnos is a correspondent for the New Yorker. We discussed his pieces on the protests in DC and coverage of US-China. See here for video of the MLK speech.
May 28, 2020
GM Corn Smuggled in Popcorn Bags: An Industrial Espionage Parable
What do you get when you take a Chinese national, a rental car, rural Iowa, and a $52 billion seed business hanging in the balance? Said one review, "not since Alfred Hitchcock's in North by Northwest has a cornfield produced so much excitement." Mara Hvistendahl's recent book, "The Scientist and the Spy," delivers a compelling narrative diving deep into the nature of Chinese industrial espionage and America's response. Do consider donating to the ChinaTalk Patreon. I also write a weekly newsletter translating and analyzing Chinese new media. This past week's edition focused on how US anti-Huawei measures are leading to calls to invade Taiwan and take TSMC.
May 21, 2020
AI Basic Research in China and the US
Who's spending big? Does it matter? Zach Arnold and Ashwin Acharya join the show to discuss their reports on Chinese public sector AI R&D spending and strengthening America's AI workforce. Do note this episode was recorded in late February. Exit music Tricky Tricky by NINEONE / CREAM D / Yoken_Official / YYKBZ / WR/OC Patreon here.
May 15, 2020
Health QR Codes and the rise of a 'Digital Leviathan'
Dan Grover joins the show to discuss his recent piece on how Chinese tech firms have handled coronavirus, I read from a recent ChinaTalk newsletter on how some mainland commentators fear that QR Health Codes will create a 'digital leviathan,' and Ravish Bhatia of the Use Case podcast shares his coronastory from India. Please consider donating to ChinaTalk's patreon.
May 6, 2020
Coronastories 3: Nanjing, Nepal, and Singapore
The legendary Yangyang Cheng discusses how Coronavirus played out in cross-continent conversations with her mother. We'll also hear from Asmod in Nepal and Lambert in Singapore. In case you haven't heard, I write a newsletter. Recent posts are on US-China and AI chips. Please consider donating to my Patreon. The closing song was from James Brown's legendary Live at the Apollo Theater, 1962.
Apr 29, 2020
Forging an Innovation Base Alliance
America has allies with solid tech. But can the US leverage these relationships to help preserve its technological edge over China? In this conversation, building off a recent CNAS report, Dan Kliman, Kristine Lee and Joshua Hitt dive deep into international defense innovation, Japan-China relations, and China's international tech ambitions. Please consider donating to my Patreon and absolutely subscribe to my newsletter. I just published a two-part series on China's health QR codes and have a great piece on US-China relations coming out next week.
Apr 23, 2020
Coronastories 2: Philippines, Russia, Taiwan
We're continuing our Coronastories series this week with personal reflections and analysis from friends of ChinaTalk on the current situations in the Philippines, Russia, and Taiwan. Oh and by the way I have a patreon and newsletter.
Apr 16, 2020
Coronastories: Dispatches from Shanghai, Beijing and Hong Kong
This week I'm trying something different. I've been interviewing my friends across China about their Coronavirus experiences, 故事FM style. We start off with Dev from Shanghai who lived through the entire lockdown and has interesting reflections on the lasting effects of social distancing on interpersonal relationships. Next, I talked with Jen about how Hong Kong has navigated the crisis. Finally, Tianyu, who flew back mid-March to Beijing, discusses mandatory self-quarantine and the process of navigating the bureaucratic mess of QR health codes. I'm planning on potentially doing a few more of these so do reach out if you feel you have a story you'd like to share, not just about China but Asia more generally. I'm JordanSchneider on wechat, email@example.com or on twitter. Do consider donating to ChinaTalk's Patreon.
Apr 9, 2020
Domestic Coronavirus Propaganda and China-Australia Relations
Adam Ni and Yun Jiang are two former Australian government officials who together write Neican(内参), a fantastic new newsletter on Chinese policy and China-Australia relations. We talk about how the CCP is trying to convince its population that post-coronavirus all is still well on the mainland. We also go into the main flashpoints from an Aussie perspective, focusing in particular on influence campaigns. I've got a newsletter too! Please consider contributing to ChinaTalk's Patreon, or better yet, a COVID-19 charity.
Apr 3, 2020
How the Party Takes its Propaganda Global
What are the CCP's international propaganda goals? How is it faring in the battle to define COVID-19's winners and losers? Matt Schrader of the German Marshall Fund's Alliance for Securing Democracy brings the mirth in these dark times. We also go into tech and discrimination, stories from time working at China Daily and SmartAir, as well as Matt's favorite Overwatch characters. The audio gets better in the second half I promise. ChinaTalk fans now have a Discord! Please consider donating to my Patreon. And yes, I'm still cranking out issues of the ChinaTalk newsletter.
Mar 25, 2020
Sinocism's Bill Bishop on the Politics of Coronavirus
Bill Bishop, author of the Sinocism newsletter, comes on the show to discuss the new low in US-China relations. We start off talking about what China's response to coronavirus has taught us about the CCP and then go into the deeper forces behind why the Chinese government has started to blame America for creating the virus. We also touch on China-Taiwan relations, the role Sinocim plays in agenda-setting, as well as binge-able Chinese tv. Please consider donating to my show's Patreon. TV shows discussed: Da Jiang Da He: ENG SUB | Like A Flowing River - EP 01 [Wang Kai, Yang Shuo，Dong Zi Jian] The Longest Day in Chang An: 【ENG SUB】《长安十二时辰》第1集（易烊千玺 / 雷佳音 / 周一围）| 加入Caravan中文剧场会员，抢先独享全季内容！ Xiao Huan Xi: 小歡喜 01 | A Little Reunion 01（黃磊、海清、陶虹等主演） Story of Yanxi Palace 延禧攻略 01 | Story of Yanxi Palace 01（秦岚、聂远、佘诗曼、吴谨言…
Mar 13, 2020
How Chinese Governance Fundamentals Impact Health Care and National Security
How has the distinct nature of local-central relations in the Chinese system impacted its response to coronavirus? To discuss, we have on Ryan Manuel, managing director of Official China, a consultancy that goes deep into CCP regulations and policy. Ryan previously taught at KHU and ANU as well as worked for the Australian government. Our wide-ranging conversation filled with dashes of dark Aussie humor starts with COVID-19 and SARS and then broadens out into how the history of rural healthcare in China explains dynamics that impeded the initial Chinese response. Next, we focus on how Hu Jintao created a model of managing local central relations that Xi studied and took to the next level by scrapping collective responsibility and working through Party as opposed to government channels. Also, we're on the Lawfare Network now! Thanks to everyone at SupChina who has contributed to this show over the past years. SUBSCRIBE TO MY NEWSLETTER! Patreon here.
1 hr 26 min
Feb 5, 2020
Outraged by the outbreak: Citizen journalism and coronavirus censorship
Tony Lin is a producer at Quartz for the web series Because China and an avid observer of Chinese online communities, such as Weibo. After the outbreak of the novel coronavirus in Wuhan, Tony noticed commentary being widely shared that, in other times, would have been censored immediately. In this episode, Jordan and Tony create a timeline of the coronavirus, analyze the strikingly candid nature of online discussion in the early days of the outbreak, and explore broader themes of censorship and the role of media in Chinese society. If you’d like to support ChinaEconTalk, please consider donating to Jordan’s Patreon here. You can also subscribe to his newsletter at chinaecontalk.substack.com.
Jan 31, 2020
Tesla’s future in China, technology tensions, and the trade war on ‘pause’
Gordon Orr is a senior adviser at McKinsey & Company and a non-executive board member at both Lenovo and Meituan-Dianping. In this week’s episode of China EconTalk, he and Jordan examine collateral economic damages as a result of the trade war, take a look at the role of the Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States and how it could change in an era of increasing U.S.-China tensions, and forecast Tesla’s future in China, which could be tied to Huawei telecommunications infrastructure in Germany. 4:16: The economic consequences of the trade war 16:42: Industrial policy in China 24:08: Hong Kong financial markets 29:02: Electronic vehicles and Tesla’s Chinese dream 37:26: Chinese consumers don’t want to buy houses
Jan 23, 2020
Izzy Niu on the Chinese diaspora and popular culture
Izzy Niu is a video journalist for the Quartz web series Because China, and the host of the Chinese-language podcast Loud Murmurs, which discusses Western movies and TV. In this episode, Jordan, Izzy, and guest co-host Athena Cao discuss the promise and peril of publishing sensitive podcasts in the Chinese language in the P.R.C., the documentaries One Child Nation and American Factory, how Chinese internet users responded to The Farewell, and the changing experiences of Chinese nationals studying and traveling abroad. 2:10: Censored in China 17:05: The reactions of Chinese netizens to The Farewell 34:14: Izzy’s documentary work at Quartz 38:28: The changing experience of Chinese tourists abroad If you’d like to support ChinaEconTalk, please consider donating to Jordan’s Patreon here. You can also subscribe to his newsletter at chinaecontalk.substack.com.
Jan 15, 2020
Out of the Gobi: Weijian Shan on the Cultural Revolution, economic reform, and U.S.-China ties
How does a bookish Beijing teenager, who found himself stuck for six years planting potatoes in the Gobi Desert, grow up to study with former chair of the Federal Reserve Janet Yellen, teach at Wharton, and now lead one of Asia's most successful investment firms? In this episode, Shàn Wěijiàn 单伟建, the chairman and CEO of investment firm PAG Group, and the author of Out of the Gobi: My Story of China and America, tells his personal story of exile during the Cultural Revolution and provides his view on China’s economic transformation. 7:53: Looking back at the Cultural Revolution 23:53: The government’s role in China’s economic development 25:22: Challenges that state-run companies face 42:11: What to make of the protests in Hong Kong Also, Jordan is relaunching his ChinaEconTalk Patreon account! If you'd like to support him and the show, please consider donating here. In addition, you can subscribe to the ChinaEconTalk newsletter at chinaecontalk.substack.com.
Jan 9, 2020
The changing nature of U.S.-China tech competition
Adam Segal, director of the Digital and Cyberspace Policy Program at the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR), joins Jordan to talk about technology competition between the United States and China. In this episode, they discuss a recent report by CFR titled Innovation and National Security: Keeping Our Edge, which examines the increasingly vexed technology ties between the two countries and the implications of tech nationalism worldwide. 11:44: Undue pressure on Chinese scientists 16:39: Does it matter who invests in research and development? 21:26: Would antitrust regulation impact industry research and development? 30:21: The civil-military divide and Silicon Valley culture
Dec 11, 2019
Online discourse and censorship in China
Jane Li, a Chongqing native and a technology reporter for Quartz, talks through some of the differences between Twitter and its Chinese equivalent, Weibo. She also discusses the website Douban, the lively and open discussion among its young users, and the threat that looming censorship poses to it. In addition, she provides details on why some Chinese internet users have turned their backs on Huawei in the wake of an extended jail term served by one of its employees. 4:10: Twitter vs. Weibo — what’s the difference? 6:52: The “China Twitter” maelstrom 11:06: Online discourse regarding the Hong Kong protests 14:23: What is “251” and how does it relate to Huawei? 20:04: The Douban online ecosystem
Nov 27, 2019
A walk down Chang’an Avenue, with Jonathan Chatwin
Can one street tell China’s story? Jonathan Chatwin, author of Long Peace Street: A Walk in Modern China, takes listeners on a tour of Chang’an Avenue, a major artery for traffic in central Beijing, which was also the scene of several critical moments in China’s modern history. Jordan and Jonathan discuss the symbolism of national buildings and monuments along it, and the role of the street as a place of protest and a part of China’s revolutionary history. 11:05: Baobaoshan Revolutionary Cemetery 20:22: The Beijing Museum 32:26: The Forbidden City 44:51: Chang’an Avenue, the sterile highway
1 hr 7 min
Nov 20, 2019
China tech policy and competition, with Paul Triolo
Paul Triolo, practice head of geotechnology at the Eurasia Group, sat down with Jordan to address some of the questions at the center of the U.S.-China tech relationship: the future of 5G research and innovation, persecutions of researchers and scientists from China based in the U.S., security concerns surrounding Huawei and Chinese-funded communications infrastructure, and more. 6:38: Current blind spots in Chinese tech policy 18:30: What does a “good” tech policy look like? 32:09: Is change possible under Xi Jinping? 42:16: What makes Huawei competitive? The Eurasia Group has no clients in the People's Republic of China.
Nov 13, 2019
Reinterpreting Beijing and its history
Jeremiah Jenne, history teacher, writer, and the man behind Beijing by Foot, is in the guest seat this week. He speaks with Jordan about the changes — both tangible and intangible — that Beijing has undergone in the last few decades. They chat about how Chinese history is reinterpreted through the lenses of different regimes, the ways in which this new history is presented to the world, and Beijing’s modernizing cityscape and the varied reactions it is met with. 10:57: Out with the old, in with the new 15:17: What to make of the Qing dynasty, with help from the CCP 27:40: An age of censorship 29:37: History is different in Beijing and Taipei Use promo code ChinaEconTalk for 20% off at https://www.outlier-linguistics.com/
Oct 23, 2019
Chasing the dragon: Fentanyl, China, and the opioid crisis
Puzzled by rising drug deaths at raves in the United States, author and investigative journalist Ben Westhoff set out to find answers. A Google search for “Buy fentanyl in China” took him down a rabbit hole that led to a face-to-face meeting with the CEO of a company selling fentanyl on Skype “all day long” and a drug lab in Shanghai. Ben tells Jordan the remarkable story. 5:06: The digital rabbit hole 9:20: Want to make fentanyl? Just Google it. 13:57: Between Heisenberg and Pfizer 22:17: How suppliers dodge U.S. Customs
Oct 16, 2019
Hashing out China tech with Lulu Chen
Bloomberg technology reporter Lulu Chen gives the scoop on the tech world in China: what’s to come for Alibaba under newly minted CEO Daniel Zhang, the long-standing grudge Meituan CEO Wang Xing holds against Jack Ma, the Communist Party’s growing presence within technology companies, and her own views on reporting on tech in China. 2:07: Hong Kong protests 24:03: Daniel Zhang’s new venture 28:11: Meituan drama 36:22: International expansion of Chinese tech
Oct 9, 2019
An Alternative Vision of U.S.-China Relations with Jake Sullivan
Jake Sullivan served in the Obama administration as National Security Advisor to Vice President Joe Biden and Director of Policy Planning at the U.S. State Department. He currently teaches at Yale Law School. In this episode, Sullivan discusses his perspectives on the current U.S.-China relationship, his experiences working in the Obama administration and on the campaign trail with Hillary Clinton campaign, and the ways our relationships with other governments around the world are changing under Trump. What to listen for on this week's ChinaEconTalk: 5:05: Reflections on the Obama years 19:03: A case for internationalism 27:46: Doing more to achieve less with China 45:20: The direction of U.S. foreign policy
Oct 2, 2019
U.S. Foreign Policy in Asia
Mira Rapp-Hooper, senior fellow at the Council of Foreign Relations, provides an overview of the history of U.S. foreign policy from Washington’s farewell address to the modern day. She also discusses the implications of a rising China for the future of U.S. alliances. 3:20: The costs of going it alone 10:41: Cold War “Great Power” competition 36:32: The Taiwan Strait crisis 41:47: Trump and the future of U.S. alliances
Sep 25, 2019
ChinaEconTalk, Live from Washington, D.C.
ChinaEconTalk is live from the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace in Washington, D.C., with Martijn Rasser, a senior fellow in the Technology and National Security Program at the Center for a New American Security. Host Jordan Schneider sits down with Martijn to discuss a few of the more contentious topics surrounding the ongoing friction between the United States and China, including rare earths, the strategic implications of 5G, concerns about Huawei software and security, and global ICT standard setting.
Sep 11, 2019
Tarriffs, taxes, and trade: Doug Irwin on ChinaEconTalk
Douglas Irwin is the John French Professor of Economics at Dartmouth College and the author of Clashing Over Commerce: A History of US Trade Policy. On this episode, Irwin provides an overview to the history of U.S. trade policy from the 18th century to the modern day, highlighting significant legislation as well as the formation of important intergovernmental organizations that have sprung up along the way. 19:53: On the flawed logic behind the Tariff Act of 1930, and the parallels with similarly problematic thinking in the modern day: “There’s absolutely a parallel there because some Democrats in Congress said, ‘You know, we ought to really think about this carefully, and not just our domestic interest but also our export interests, and other countries might retaliate.’ And basically, the reaction of most members of Congress was, Republicans at the time, ‘No, we don’t have to worry about that. This is a domestic piece of legislation, it doesn’t really concern other cou…
1 hr 7 min
Sep 4, 2019
How China Can Take Over Tech
Douglas Fuller is an associate professor in the Department of Asian and International Studies at the City University of Hong Kong and the author of Paper Tiger, Hidden Dragons: Firms and the Political Economy of China’s Technological Development. In his book, Fuller explores a question that has hounded heads of state around the world for decades: How can a developing country get ahead in the tech sector? Drawing on the results of 499 interviews from experts over the course of 15 years, Fuller discusses China’s answer to this question in the context of its attempts to dominate the global semiconductor industry. Fuller and Jordan also touch on the transformative impact of the trade war and the concept of technology transfer and their implications for the immediate future of the Chinese tech sector. Jordan’s newsletter is now available for sign-ups: chinaecontalk.substack.com. In the past few weeks, he’s translated articles on topics like the troubled future of VPNs in China, the…
Aug 28, 2019
Tech triangles and AI ethics: Danit Gal on Chinese AI
Danit Gal is a former Yenching Scholar and coauthor of a recent paper, “Perspectives and Approaches to AI Ethics: East Asia.” On this episode, Gal discusses how Japanese, South Korean, and Chinese experts are forging new paths in the field of artificial intelligence (AI), exploring societal applications — and the unexpected drawbacks of “female” virtual assistants. Gal also explains the tech connections between China and Israel, and the possible impact of the U.S.-China trade war on this relationship. What to listen for on this week’s ChinaEconTalk: 15:56: Gal on her trip to Longquan Monastery in Beijing: “They basically have a Chinese robot monk, named Xian’er. I spoke to him and he gives you all these responses and talks to you about the deep meaning of Buddhist ceremonies… And then I asked him, ‘Who is your master?’ And then he answered to me very clearly, ‘The data is my master.’ And the monks freaked out — they [said] ‘No, no, no. We give him the da…
Aug 21, 2019
The View from Chengdu: Freelance Reporting Outside First-Tier Cities
On this episode of ChinaEconTalk, Jordan interviews Lauren Teixeira, a freelance reporter based in Chengdu, Sichuan Province. After what has been a jam-packed few months of China news, Lauren discusses a wide range of topics, from engaging with mainlanders about the anti-Extradition Bill protests in Hong Kong to the downsides of Chinese superblock urban planning. Lauren finishes the interview with a wide-ranging introduction to contemporary pop culture artists in China whose innovation and creativity are helping people to stay inspired at a challenging time. What to listen for on this week’s ChinaEconTalk: 6:59: Lauren recalls Ian Johnson’s comments to her during their conversation on engaging in political discussions in China: “He said to me, ‘There’s a ceiling for your rhetoric because at some point you can’t tell someone to “look it up” because they can’t look it up.’ Epistemologically you’re not on even ground. And so, if you want to really get into a real d…
Aug 15, 2019
Reform and Opening with Soviet Characteristics: Russian Perspectives on China’s Rise
This week on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan interviews Chris Miller, associate professor of international history at Tufts University and a specialist on Russian politics, economics, and foreign policy. Drawing on some of his recent publications, Miller discusses topics ranging from Sino-Soviet collaboration and competition to their respective economic and political reform programs in the 1970s and 80s. Miller concludes by exploring the significance of the collapse of the USSR in terms of the impression it made on Chinese officials, including Xi Jinping, and what this may suggest about the future of Chinese politics and the ongoing Sino-Russian relationship. As Xi himself is reported to have said during a closed-door meeting in 2012: “Why did the Soviet Union disintegrate? Why did the Soviet Communist Party collapse? … Finally, all it took was one quiet word from Gorbachev to declare the dissolution of the Soviet Communist Party, and a great party was gone. In the end nobody was a real man,…
1 hr 2 min
Aug 9, 2019
East Asian AI: Researching Chinese, Japanese, and Korean Tech in Canada
This week on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan speaks with Dongwoo Kim, a postgraduate research fellow at the Asia Pacific Foundation of Canada who specializes in AI. Dongwoo discusses his research on the progress of AI development in Japan, Korea, and China, including the challenges faced by Chinese AI researchers overseas, and the need for greater tech literacy in general. What to listen for on this week’s ChinaEconTalk: 4:49: Misconceptions abound when it comes to AI, as do references to “Skynet” from the Terminator movies. “Strictly speaking, that’s not what we’re talking about,” Dongwoo says. “People have such a misunderstanding about this, and also the way in which we’re using AI now, it’s kind of subtle, right? It’s used by Google, it’s used by Facebook. If you don’t have the tech literacy, you’re not always going to be aware of it. So I think there’s a potential that if we don’t educate people about what AI really is and why this matters, we might get to a…
Jul 31, 2019
The Party in Cyberspace: China’s Digital Ecosystem
This week, Jordan speaks with Graham Webster, a China digital economy fellow and coordinating editor of the DigiChina project at New America. He was previously a senior fellow and lecturer at Yale Law School’s Paul Tsai China Center. The two talked about Graham’s work at DigiChina, artificial intelligence in China and its complex legal infrastructure, the facts (and fiction) behind China’s controversial social credit system, and the potential for a new cold war between the U.S. and China. What to listen for on this week’s ChinaEconTalk: 10:23: “If the Chinese government wants to step on Huawei or somebody to get access to data, they’re not going to need this particular provision of law to do it. I think it’s a similar case with VPNs and these cross-border data rules. The pretty clear intent behind these rules is to expand on an increasingly detailed regime for protecting Chinese peoples’ data from abuse by companies or cyber criminals or just breaches due to bad secur…
Jul 23, 2019
Little Red Book, Big Red Ideas: Part 2 of A Global History of Maoism
This week, in part 2 of a special two-part edition of ChinaEconTalk, Jordan interviews Professor Julia Lovell, author of the recently published book on Mao’s international legacy entitled Maoism: A Global History. In this episode, Lovell recounts the ways in which Maoism truly started going global in the 1950s and 1960s. With some prompting courtesy of the Chinese government’s propaganda machine, self-described Maoist groups sprang up in Southeast Asia, sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America, Western Europe, and even the U.S. Lovell explains how groups around the world interpreted the works and words of Mao in various ways and with varying results — from Black Panthers hosting study sessions of Mao’s Little Red Book in the U.S. to members of the Shining Path who espoused a Marxist-Leninist-Maoist ideology as they committed acts of guerilla warfare in Peru. Sign up here for the ChinaEconTalk newsletter. Learn more about CLI here and use the promo code 'jordan' for $100 off any prog…
1 hr 5 min
Jul 17, 2019
Little Red Book, Big Red Ideas: Part 1 of A Global History of Maoism
This week, in part 1 of a special two-part edition of ChinaEconTalk, Jordan interviews Professor Julia Lovell, author of the recently published book on Mao’s international legacy entitled Maoism: A Global History. In this episode, Lovell introduces the core tenets of Maoist thought and its complex impact on both the Chinese Communist Party and other, offshoot devotees around the world. She outlines the key events in Mao’s life, the events that helped shaped his ideology, his idea of “violent, tumultuous world revolution,” and the friction during the Cold War that eventually culminated in the Sino-Soviet split. Sign up here for the ChinaEconTalk newsletter. Learn more about CLI here and use the promo code 'jordan' for $100 off any program. Quotes to listen for in this episode: 15:10: “Maoism, although it has this singular name, it doesn’t actually correspond to a single, unitary phenomenon...it’s a set of ideas and practices that is living and breathing that has been tra…
Jul 10, 2019
Learning to listen: China's billion-dollar podcast industry
While it may be a pipe dream for ChinaEconTalk to ever merit a billion-dollar price tag, in China, podcast “unicorns” are everywhere. Companies like Ximalaya and Yudao have multibillion-dollar valuations, but feature startlingly different content from what consumers expect in the West. What drives these differences, and what does the future hold for spoken audio in China? To answer these questions, Yi Yang, a young podcast host and founder of the Mandarin-language podcast startup JustPod 播客一下, joins Jordan to explain how, after the advent of podcasts in China, people are finally “learning to listen.” Yi Yang's original podcast is called LeftRight 忽左忽右. His two branded podcasts are Startup Insider 创业内幕 and Bessie’s Notes 贝望录. ChinaEconTalk's newsletter is dope. Sign up here at www.chinaecontalk.substack.com. The latest issues include an analysis of why Amazon lost in China and learn about the bane of China’s automobile industry.
Jun 21, 2019
Of cell phones and seed prices: The Chinese legal system in theory and practice
This week on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan speaks with Donald Clarke, a specialist in Chinese law and the David Weaver Research Professor at George Washington University. Following a thorough introduction to the structure of the Chinese legal system starting from the Qing dynasty, Clarke discusses a provocative article he recently co-authored, Who owns Huawei?, which discusses in detail the legal ownership of Huawei Technology Co., Ltd. Clarke also deconstructs Huawei’s own legal arguments regarding whether its products (and, by extension, customers’ data) is subject to the Cybersecurity Law of the PRC and the National Intelligence Law of the PRC.
Jun 14, 2019
The Future of U.S.-China Relations: Is ‘Collective Pressure' the Answer?
This week, in the second installment of the series “The Future of U.S.-China Relations” on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan speaks with Professor Hal Brands of the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies and Zack Cooper, a research fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. In addition to offering some prescriptions for relieving some of the tension points in the U.S.-China relationship more generally, the pair discuss the major takeaways from their co-published paper in the Texas National Security Review, “After Responsible Stakeholder, What? Debating America’s China Policy.”
Jun 7, 2019
From Beijing to Cairo: Peter Hessler on What Makes a Real Revolution
This week on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan speaks with veteran journalist Peter Hessler. Peter spent seven years in China as a correspondent for The New Yorker, followed by five years in Egypt. In this episode, Peter discusses his long and prolific career reporting on the society, politics, and culture of these two dynamic nations; he also considers the similarities and differences in the ways the Chinese and Egyptian people make sense of their respective places in the world based on their rich historical and cultural legacies. In addition, Peter reflects on the 30th anniversary of the Tiananmen Square massacre, and contrasts it with the 2013 mass protests and eventual coup d'état in Cairo. Check out the ChinaEconTalk newsletter here, and please leave us a review on iTunes!
1 hr 17 min
May 30, 2019
How Local Bureaucrats Helped Create Chinese Tech Giants
Why did Shenzhen, a backwater fishing village, spawn the likes of industry leaders ZTE, Huawei, and Lenovo, while Suzhou, which previously scored massive investments from top “dragon head” foreign firms like Samsung and Philips, failed to spawn domestic innovation? What role did FDI and the local bureaucrats in charge of economic development play? And what lessons does this story hold for today's Chinese industrial policy as well as development and innovation economics more broadly? For answers, we turn to Ling Chen, an assistant professor at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies, and the author of the recent book Manipulating Globalization: The Influence of Bureaucrats on Business in China.
1 hr 3 min
May 22, 2019
The Future of U.S.-China Economic Relations: The Case for Change
This week, ChinaEconTalk launches its “Future of U.S.-China Economic Relations” miniseries with an interview featuring Melanie Hart, a senior fellow and the director of China Policy at the Center for American Progress. At the Center, Melanie specializes in U.S.-China foreign policy and explores new opportunities for bilateral cooperation on topics such as energy, climate change, and cross-border investment. In this episode, she discusses the central arguments in two of her recent articles, "Mapping China's global governance ambitions" and "Limit, leverage, and compete: A new strategy on China,” and lays out her vision for what progressive U.S. policy making in response to new political trends in China might look like. Check out the ChinaEconTalk newsletter here, and please leave us a review on iTunes!
May 17, 2019
Harnessing the Educational Power of AI
Over 100 million Chinese adults have used the Liulishuo (流利说 liúlì shuō) app to learn English through AI-powered tutoring. This week on ChinaEconTalk, host Jordan Schneider interviews Liulishuo co-founder and CTO Ben Hu about the company’s journey from its early days to its recent listing on NASDAQ. Along the way, they discuss the current state of development of Liulishuo’s speech-recognition capabilities, general strategies for Chinese companies seeking to succeed abroad, and the motivational stories of some of the app’s users. Please take a moment to review ChinaEconTalk on iTunes.
May 8, 2019
Huawei May, But How?: China's Role in Global IT Infrastructure
Is Huawei unfairly maligned or rightly feared? Are the tech supply chains running through China a marvel of 21st-century globalization, or dangerous oversight on the part of U.S. tech firms and the federal government? Today’s guest on ChinaEconTalk — Nick Weaver, a researcher at the International Computer Science Institute and a lecturer at UC Berkeley — provides some clarity. Huawei and other Chinese tech titans have found themselves on the defensive, pushing back against allegations of system backdoors and Chinese government influence. In layman’s terms, Nick explains some of the technical aspects behind the fears that have arisen around China’s role in tech supply chains and information technology infrastructure around the world. Please take a moment to review ChinaEconTalk on iTunes!
May 1, 2019
Aerial Acrobatics: China's Aviation Industry
This week on ChinaEconTalk, host Jordan Schneider discusses China’s aviation industry with Neil Thomas, Research Associate at the Paulson Institute’s in-house think tank, MacroPolo. Focusing on Boeing’s long history in China, they explore how the company’s interactions with the state have actually proven to be a microcosm of the larger U.S.-China relationship — from early involvement navigating business in the Mao era to the more recent period of strategic competition. Jordan and Neil reflect on this remarkable evolution, and debate whether China’s dependence on U.S. aviation technology is sustainable or even desirable from a Chinese perspective.
Apr 24, 2019
Red Guards to Red Entrepreneurs: How Mao Era Thought Seeps Into Modern Chinese Business
In this episode of ChinaEconTalk, host Jordan Schneider interviews Professor Christopher Marquis, professor at Cornell’s SC Johnson College of Business. Christopher discusses a few of his recent publications, which focus primarily on how Chinese communist ideology impacts thinking within private sector firms and policy implementation by Chinese politicians. Recommended reading: Also by Christopher Marquis: Waking from Mao’s Dream: Communist Ideological Imprinting and the Internationalization of Entrepreneurial Ventures in China Defending Mao’s Dream: How Politicians’ Ideological Imprinting Affects Firms’ Political Appointment in China. You can subscribe to the ChinaEconTalk newsletter here: chinaecontalk.substack.com.
Apr 18, 2019
ChinaEconTalk Crossover Episode: China Tech Investor Podcast
This week’s episode is a crossover with the China Tech Investor podcast. Join Jordan in conversation with China Tech Investor co-hosts James Hull and Elliot Zaagman as they discuss their perspectives on Chinese ecommerce, live streaming, fashion, the lessons Facebook is learning from WeChat, and emerging investment opportunities.
Apr 10, 2019
China's exploited tech workers fight back
This episode of ChinaEconTalk features a discussion with two of the people behind recent, high-profile efforts to mobilize Chinese programmers against labor exploitation via GitHub, the world’s leading software development platform: Suji Yan, CEO of Dimension, and Katt Gu, J.D., Advisor at Asian-Pacific Blockchain Development Association and PhD candidate in informatics at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. Suji and Katt are on the front lines of a growing movement of thousands protesting working conditions for Chinese tech workers, which are characterized by outrageously long working hours — a practice widely referred to as “996,” shorthand for shops that require staff to work “from 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., six days a week.” In response, Suji and Katt developed and published the “Anti-996 License,” which allows developers to prohibit the use of their code by entities that do not adhere to basic labor standards. The license has been adopted by over 2,000 softwar…
Mar 20, 2019
Building – and Selling – the Great Firewall
This week on ChinaEconTalk, host Jordan Schneider speaks with James Griffiths, senior producer for CNN International, to discuss his new book, The Great Firewall of China: How to Build and Control an Alternative Version of the Internet. Together, they trace the history of the internet in China, from the early, heady days of relative freedom through the slow but steady tightening of government controls, and discuss China’s recent efforts to export its comprehensive model of internet censorship. Along the way, they consider questions on a range of issues including the impact of Google and the tireless efforts of netizens to work around online restrictions.
Mar 14, 2019
One hour, Two Sessions
One hour, Two Sessions China’s Two Sessions, the national annual gathering of the leadership of the People’s Republic of China, will soon be coming to a close. This week on ChinaEconTalk, Jordan sat down with Chris Beddor, a columnist for Reuters Breakingviews, to discuss highlights from this year’s gathering, including state-owned enterprise reform, implications for Made in China 2025, the evolving role of Li Keqiang, and more. Subscribe to the ChinaEconTalk newsletter here.
Mar 6, 2019
ChinaEconTalk with special guest Russ Roberts
This week's guest is Russ Roberts. He's a research fellow at Stanford's Hoover Institution and the host of the EconTalk podcast, a weekly interview-based show that’s vaguely about economics but that has, over time, evolved into an extended meditation on the human condition. Its diverse topics in the last few weeks have included Solzhenitsyn, the 2008 financial crisis, and gratitude. Even though this conversation will have little or nothing to do with China, seeing as Russ served as the inspiration for the ChinaEconTalk podcast, I hope you all find it interesting.
Feb 27, 2019
Rubber ducks and semiconductors: Navigating China’s legal system
“The champagne days are over,” writes Dan Harris, reflecting on how the tone of his China Law Blog has evolved since its creation in 2006. As the founder of Harris Bricken, an international law firm with a major China presence, Dan has a unique window into how macro changes in China’s economy and trade relations play out within a law firm. In this conversation, Jordan and Dan discuss common misconceptions about the law in China; memorable Chinese legal scams; joint ventures in China; day-to-day operations of an international law firm in the country; intellectual property cases and enforcement within the Chinese legal system on the mainland.
Feb 20, 2019
Diplomatic bookkeeping with Ryan Hass
This week’s guest on ChinaEconTalk is Ryan Hass, a David M. Rubenstein Fellow in the Brookings Institution’s Foreign Policy program, who is jointly appointed to the John L. Thornton China Center and the Center for East Asia Policy Studies. From 2013 to 2017, he served as the director for China, Taiwan, and Mongolia at the National Security Council (NSC) during President Obama’s second term. Ryan offers reflections on his time at the NSC; the diplomatic strategies and objectives regarding U.S.-China relations during his time in the White House; elaboration on an article he co-authored at Brookings titled “Assessing U.S.-China relations 2 years into the Trump presidency”; and thoughts on the trajectory of the bilateral relationship under the current administration. Check out our newsletter at www.chinaecontalk.substack.com. Also, join the fan club and rate ChinaEconTalk on iTunes!
Feb 15, 2019
China’s foothold in India’s tech ecosystem
Today, nearly half of the top 100 apps in India's Google Play store are made by Chinese companies. After past failures to enter the Indian tech market, what's driving China tech's sudden success on the subcontinent? How have new Chinese companies like Bytedance and Xiaomi been able to localize more successfully than the likes of Tencent in the early 2010s? And just how seriously do Chinese firms take issues like child porn and fake news in India? To explore these topics, we spoke with Shadma Shaikh, a writer at Factor Daily. She and Jordan examine the multiple different aspects of China’s growing presence in India’s technology space. They also discuss the successes and failures of Chinese tech companies in India, the strategies that helped those companies find success, and the unique features of Indian culture (such as multiple languages), which have created difficulties for Western and Chinese tech companies that are eager to gain access to the Indian tech market. ChinaEc…
Feb 6, 2019
The Obama era of U.S.-China economic relations
How did the U.S.-China economic relationship evolve during the Obama administration? Are the economic tensions we see today between the two countries a product of inevitable forces, or more contingent on the choices of the Trump and Xi administrations? To discuss these topics and more, we have on today’s show Caroline Atkinson, who served as President Barack Obama’s deputy national security adviser for international economics.
Jan 30, 2019
A ‘Qianlong’ look back at China’s economic history
How does autocratic repression impact societies? Can the legacy of political repression ripple out across centuries, creating a vicious autocratic cycle? Today, on ChinaEconTalk, we're going back to the Qing dynasty — the time of the Qianlong Emperor, and before — to find out. Our guest is Melanie Meng Xue, a postdoctoral fellow at the Department of Economics and the Center for Economic History at Northwestern University, whose recent paper on the topic can be found here.
Jan 23, 2019
Changing tides in 2019, with Gordon Orr
“The U.S.-China equilibrium of the past 20 years has gone,” declares Gordon Orr in his recent piece on what to expect in China in 2019. So what will replace it? What impact will the increasingly activist Chinese government have on the broader economy? And what broader reflections does a 30-year China veteran have about recent changes in China? Orr is currently a director emeritus at McKinsey, having previously helped open the firm’s Beijing office and led its Greater China practice. He is also a board member of Lenovo and Meituan Dianping. Check out the new ChinaEconTalk newsletter here.
Jan 16, 2019
The world’s largest video game industry
China’s video game market is the world’s largest. Over 600 million people play video games in China, and collectively, they spend over $40 billion a year on games. This episode, featuring Abacus reporter Josh Ye and localization expert Frankie Huang, explores the market as well as gaming culture in China. Check out our newsletter exploring the best long-form Chinese reporting on tech and business at chinaecontalk.substack.com.
Jan 9, 2019
The rise and fall of a Suzhou soft-serve baron
Mister Softee, the famed northeastern American ice cream brand, in Suzhou, China? Yes, that was a thing. Turner Sparks, rising from humble beginnings as just another English teacher making his way in the world, achieved fame and fortune thanks to a catchy jingle and some tasty mango-flavored soft serve. Yet his vision of China-wide ice cream domination dissolved amid a deluge of backstabbing regulators, slashed tires, and stolen cones. Listen here to learn about the circumstances that finally melted Turner's ice cream dream. Check out our newsletter covering the latest in Chinese-language tech and business reporting here.
1 hr 6 min
Jan 3, 2019
Chinese Policymaking Made Easy with Trivium China
Chinese politics is boring and confusing. Or is it? This week Jordan speaks with Andrew Polk and Trey McArver, economics and politics specialists at Trivium China. The three discuss the size of the Chinese bureaucracy, how policy is formed and implemented, and the Chinese economy. Check out the Trivium China's daily tip sheet for "a cheeky dose of China analysis" each morning. Sign up to the recently launched ChinaEconTalk newsletter, a weekly look into Chinese-language sources on business, tech, and the broader economy. Feel free to out to Jordan directly on Twitter, LinkedIn, or on wechat at jordanschneider. And lastly, scan here to join the ChinaEconTalk wechat group:
Dec 13, 2018
The Chinese Financial Crisis That Never Came, with Logan Wright
Foreign investors have lost billions expecting a Chinese financial crisis that hasn't come yet. So what gives? According to the Rhodium Group's Logan Wright, it's not China's domestic savings rate or RMB-denominated debt that’s keeping the economy afloat, but rather the government's credibility.
1 hr 4 min
Dec 5, 2018
Daniel Kurtz-Phelan on George Marshall’s China Mission
Daniel Kurtz-Phelan, the executive editor of Foreign Affairs, is the author of the recent book The China Mission: George Marshall's Unfinished War, 1945–1947. George Marshall, World War II hero and creator of the Marshall Plan, spent 1945-47 drinking baijiu with Mao and playing croquet with Chiang Kai-shek, fighting to stave off a civil war. Was the “loss of China” to the CCP inevitable? Did Marshall, with his strategy of forcing reconciliation on the Nationalists and Communists, in any way contribute to it? And what can we learn from Marshall's expedition to China about the limits of American influence abroad? If you have a professional opportunity you think Jordan might be a good fit for, please reach out to him at https://www.linkedin.com/in/jorschneider/, firstname.lastname@example.org, or JordanSchneider on WeChat. Thanks so much!
Nov 20, 2018
China's Domestic Sports Market With Mark Dreyer
China's government aims to create a $500 billion sports industry by 2020. But how are those ambitions playing out on the ground in the Chinese basketball and soccer leagues? There's more to sports in China than the well-known problems of exorbitant transfer fees and match fixing, but with the government apparently unable to resist interfering in private leagues, does China have much hope for ever developing world-class teams? SupChina columnist and longtime China sports watcher Mark Dreyer gives his take.
Nov 13, 2018
How Chinese Firms Succeed and Fail at Internationalizing (Featuring Bytedance)
What is Bytedance and how does it make its money? How do politics and culture get in the way of Chinese firms' internationalization efforts? What can Chinese phones in Africa and electric buses in LA teach us about localization challenges? Elliott Zaagman, co-host of TechNode's China Tech Investor podcast, takes on these issues for the latest episode of ChinaEconTalk.
1 hr 2 min
Nov 6, 2018
KFC, the Business of Propaganda, and the 'Toilet Revolution'
Why is KFC so big in China? What is the “Toilet Revolution” and why does it matter? How does Chinese propaganda work? How have bicycles’ role in Chinese society evolved over time? Neil Thomas of MacroPolo takes on all this in ChinaEconTalk’s latest show.
1 hr 3 min
Nov 1, 2018
Matt Sheehan on Google in China
What is the history of Google in China? Does the company have any hope of bringing its search engine back into the Chinese market? How does China’s development of artificial intelligence stack up against the rest of the world’s? To answer these questions, Matt Sheehan of MacroPolo makes his triumphant return to ChinaEconTalk.
Oct 24, 2018
When Trade Wars Turned Bloody: The Opium War with Stephen Platt
When it came to trade wars, the British didn't mess around. Four steam-powered battleships sent by the English to force China to change its trade policy in the mid-19th century changed the course of history. But how did they end up fighting the Chinese in the first place, and what are the contemporary echoes of this historical trade fight? Stephen Platt, the author of the recent Imperial Twilight: The Opium War and the End of China's Last Golden Age, answers these questions and more on the latest episode of ChinaEconTalk.
1 hr 11 min
Oct 19, 2018
Tencent's History and Future with Matthew Brennan
Matt Brennan, professional speaker and co-host of China Tech Talk, comes on the show to discuss the history and evolution of China's most popular app, WeChat, as well as threats on the horizon for the company that created it, Tencent.
Oct 9, 2018
David Dollar on U.S.-China financial friction
David Dollar is a senior fellow at the John L. Thornton China Center at the Brookings Institution. He has previously served as the U.S. Treasury Department emissary to Beijing during the Obama Administration, and the World Bank's country director for China and Mongolia. He discusses his storied career and the recent history of U.S.-China financial relations, including the current trade war's origins in the 2008 financial crisis.
Oct 3, 2018
China’s Grand AI Ambitions with Jeff Ding
Rhodes Scholar Jeff Ding breaks down how China stacks up to the rest of the world in the race to develop AI. He delves into the connections between Chinese tech companies and government AI targets, AI’s military implications, as well as the ethical considerations of AI applications in China’s police state. We discuss his recent paper “Deciphering China’s AI Dream” as well as recent articles on AI he has translated from Chinese media on his ChinAI newsletter.
Aug 27, 2018
Trade War Tale of the Tape with Chad Bown
Chad Bown is a fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics in Washington, DC and cohost of the excellent Trade Talks, a weekly podcast on the economics of international trade policy. In this episode, we discuss the competing grand strategies of US and China as well as their different tactics for executing their trade war policies. We touch on potential internal inconsistencies in Trump's trade outlook, the implications for the USD and RMB, as well as potential endgames. Outtro music by VaVa
1 hr 6 min
Aug 16, 2018
Data Policy with Samm Sacks
May 13, 2018
What China Thinks of the Trade War with Chublicopinion's Ma Tianjie
Ma Tianjie, founder of the long-running blog Chublicopinion is perhaps the leading English-language chronicler of Chinese public opinion. In this episode, he discusses the official and popular responses to the trade war, ranging from hard right nationalists calling for a return to Maoist autarchy to liberals thanking Trump for pushing China to open its markets. In his day job, he works for ChinaDialogue, a site that covers Chinese environmental issues.
May 9, 2018
Trump's Trade War Tactics with Chris Balding
(The audio stops beeping after 1 minute I promise!) Chris Balding as a Bloomberg Views contributor and professor based in Shenzhen. In this interview, we discuss two recent posts on his blog Baldingsworld which both make the case for America's hard line stance toward China's economic policies as well as decry Trump's lack of skill in tactical execution.
1 hr 10 min
Apr 23, 2018
Made in China 2025 and Bytedance with Lorand Laskai
Lorand Laskai is a researcher at a prominent American think tank who recently wrote a piece on the Trump administration's animosity to Xi's Made in China 2025 program. In this episode, we discuss what exactly ticks American policymakers off about the initiative, why Chinese unicorn CEOs related to content have had to issue apologies, what moral calculations foreigners make when deciding to work for firms caught up in these sorts of issues, and the Chinese debate scene. Athena Cao, a Beijing-based industry analyst, also joined us to guest host.
1 hr 1 min
Apr 11, 2018
How China Learned to WTO with Henry Cao
Guest henry gao henry gao (@henrysgao) | Twitter Prof. Henry Gao is Associate Professor of law (tenured) at Singapore Management University and Dongfang Scholar Chair Professor at Shanghai Institute of Foreign Trade. And co-author alongside Gregory Schaffer of the recent paper China's Rise: How It Took on the U.S. at the WTO. As evidenced by China’s behavior in the recent trade scuffles with the US, it’s clear that Chinese lawyers are far from rubes when it comes to trade. In this interview, we discuss what it took for the PRC to learn to speak the language of international legal trade law and the implications this develompent had both domestically and internationally, particularly in the context of the current US-China trade war.
Mar 18, 2018
Gaming in China with Charlie Moseley and Chang Jung-Erh
Guest Charlie Moseley Washingtonian in Asia. Predisposed to wanderlust. Charlie Moseley's Personal Website charlie (@justcharlie) | Twitter China's over 600 million gamers contribute to a gaming market that generated $30 billion in 2017. ChinaEconTalk discusses this part of the Chinese economy and society with Charlie Moseley, an independent game developer and longtime resident of Chengdu, and Chang Jung-Erh (Polly), a past intern at Netease Games. Topics include the evolution of the Chinese gaming market, the impact of gaming giants Tencent and Netease, female gamers in China, and Chengdu hip hop. Mentioned in the episode: DJI university robot contest Robomasters and Chengdu-based rapper Kafe-Hu
Mar 5, 2018
Internet Finance with Martin Chorzempa
Guest Martin Chorzempa Research Fellow, @PIIE. China Econ/Finance, FinTech, Financial Development Martin Chorzempa | PIIE Martin Chorzempa (@ChorzempaMartin) | Twitter Martin Chorzempa of the Peterson Institute is over traditional finance. Instead, spends his time analyzing the wild west of innovative consumer finance in China, a space full of unicorns, ponzi schemes, and overworked regulators desperately trying to stay up with the times. We discuss the promise and peril of social credit scores like Alibaba's Sesame Credit and the boom of Chinese peer to peer lending. Martin also explains how a digital gaming currency created by Tencent in the 2000s that developed a secondary market set the pattern that you can today see with its handling of bitcoin. Outtro song: "We are all Bitcoins"
Feb 25, 2018
Nick Consonery on China's Economic Reform Trajectory
Guest Nick Consonery Director of China Macroeconomic & Policy research @rhodium_group Rhodium Group Nick Consonery (@nconsonery) | Twitter Nick Consonery of the Rhodium Group with support from the Asia Society recently published The China Dashboard. This piece of research provides a quarterly update on the key fields of economic policy reform, including topics like the environment, fiscal policy, and innovation. In this podcast, we review the dashboard's latest disappointing findings, and discuss why some policy aims may be at cross-purposes.
Jan 23, 2018
The Chinese Rustbelt with Song Houze
China's northeast, a region that in the 1970s comprised over 10% of national GDP, now only makes up 3%. In this interview, Song Houze walks listeners through the policy challenges facing the rustbest. He also provides some context behind two developments that recently made international news: a famous entrepeneur berating a local official for squeezing his ski resort and provincial-level GDP revisions.. For more research, see his recent series up on Macropolo on the province of Liaoning.
Jan 18, 2018
Oona Hathaway and Scott Shapiro on How the World Order Evolves
Guests Oona Hathaway Professor @YaleLawSch, Director @YaleLawGLC, Editor @just_security, fmr Special Counsel @DeptofDefense, co-author of The Internationalists Oona A. Hathaway - Yale Law School Oona Hathaway (@oonahathaway) on Twitter Scott Shapiro Prof @YaleLawSch + Philosophy @Yale. Visiting Quain Prof @UCLLaws. Editor, Legal Theory and Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy. #Internationalists THE INTERNATIONALISTS Scott Shapiro (@scottjshapiro) on Twitter Given how Xi today struts on the world stage with ambitions to use today's "historic opportunity" to reshape the international order, its useful to look back in history to the last time the world faced a revolution in legal norms. Yale Law Professors Scott Shapiro and Oona Hathaway recently published The Internationalists, an intellectual history of how international legal norms have evolved since the days of Grotius. In particular, they focus on the movement to outlaw war peaking in the early 20th century with the Kellogg Briand Pa…
1 hr 6 min
Jan 14, 2018
Barry Eichengreen on the Rise and Fall of Global Currencies
Barry Eichengreen, Professor of Economics and Political Science at Berkeley (not to mention one of my favorite authors of accessible yet profound global economics books) recently published his How Global Currencies Work: Past, Present, and Future. We talk about the rise of the US Dollar and how its transition to global leader was slower and more gradual than many have thought. We then turn to the Yuan and the challenges it faces as the government pushes the currency's internationalization.
Dec 22, 2017
Ex-Head of Mobile at Mobike Max Zhou on Dockless Bikeshares in China
Max Zhou 周喆吾 is an Uber alum who until November of 2017 was the head of Mobile at Mobike. He is currently working as the co-founder of Meta App. Max talks about his story coming to the US for an advanced degree, his experience at Uber, why Travis Kalanick is really a Chinese entrepreneur at heart, and his take on China's 'Uber Mafia.' He then turns to Mobike and Ofo, speaking to the potential monetization pathways for the firms, their global expansion plans, their strategic investors' competing goals and merger prospects. He even shares his own crackpot theory of how the initial investors in Ofo and Mobike may be the ones leaking negative stories about Ofo spending deposit money and senior leadership living lavish lifestyles. We close by talking about his new project, MetaApp, which aims to allow users access to an app's full feature-set without having to download it. Max also recently appeared on 非诚勿扰, China's leading dating show. His segment starts about twenty minutes…
Dec 19, 2017
Keller Easterling on Free Zones and the Origins and Global Impact of SEZs
Keller Easterling, architect and professor at Yale, discusses her research on free zones (aka Special Economic Zones). We start by discussing the history of free zones and whether the Chinese success stories of SEZs such as Shenzhen drove their proliferation around the world. We also discuss a few more next-generation free zone proposals such as the NEOM project in Saudi Arabia and Refugee Cities.
Dec 10, 2017
Peter Lorentzen on the Politics of Protest in China
Peter Lorentzen, professor of economics at the University of San Francisco, talks protests and provincial politics. We start by discussing 'Designing Contentious Politics in Post-1989 China,' which uses game theory to analyze and explain how the CCP responds to on-the-ground protests. Next, we take on his 'Racing to the Bottom or to the Top? Decentralization, Revenue Pressures, and Governance Reform in China' and explore what actually drives municipal responses to orders from on high. Music this week by 阴三儿, 北京晚报 and 没钱没朋友. Do note that after this episode was recorded, some protests against "low-end population" removal broke out.
Nov 29, 2017
Matt Sheehan on 'Chinafornia'
Matt Sheehan is a fellow at the Paulson Institute and writes his own newsletter, "Chinafornia". We discussed the evolving relationship between China and Silicon Valley, their cultural differences and commonalities and, of course, the state of Chinese rap music. Stay tuned until the end of the episode to hear Matt's favorite Chinese rap song in full.
Nov 25, 2017
Jonathan Woetzel on China's Digital Economy
Dr. Jonathan Woetzel, Mckinsey Global Institute Director and Senior Partner in the Shanghai office, recently co-authored a report entitled China's Digital Economy. In this podcast, he discusses the impact of BAT (Baidu, Alibaba, and Tencent) on the broader startup ecosystem, the role of the government in fostering these firms, and China's potential for continued economic creativity. He also astutely recommends that you read all of Jonathan Spence.
Oct 30, 2017
Julian Gewirtz on Unlikely Partners: Western Economists and Reform and Opening
Julian Gewirtz is currently a Fellow at the Harvard Kennedy School and author of Unlikely Partners: Chinese Reformers, Western Economists, and the Making of Global China. In it, he argues that "western economists played a crucial role in shaping the ideas and strategies of key CCP economists and policymakers. Without their participation, China would not have reformed as quickly, innovatively, and successfully." In this discussion, we focus on the critical 1985 Bashan Conference and the echoes of the Unlikely Partners narrative you can see even today in Chinese policymaking. Julian's book recommendations included 9 Continents and Everything Under the Heavens. Follow Julian on twitter at @JulianGewirtz.
Oct 27, 2017
The Book of Swindles: Cons from the Late Ming Dynasty
In Zhang Yingyu’s work from the late Ming Dynasty, you’ll encounter swindling concubines, clever commoners, and even eunuch cannibals trying to regrow their members. “We live in an age of deception. Words and appearances mislead. Con artists prey on the unwary. In this world of swindlers, one must rely on one’s wits to survive. How, then, to guard against the duplicity that lurks behind every smiling face? Look to your kin, keep your possessions close, and trust no one. But first, read The Book of Swindles.” Christopher Rea and Bruce Rusk, both associate professors of Asian studies at the University of British Columbia, have recently published The Book of Swindles’ first English translation. In this interview, they discuss the work's historical and cultural context as well as walk through some of the most shocking, revealing, and prurient stories The Book of Swindles has to offer.
Oct 26, 2017
Cynthia Estlund on Labor in China
China’s massive labor surplus has been vital to its rapid economic development. For decades, China’s rural population has been migrating to take up low-wage jobs in the coastal regions, often in dire conditions. The exploitation of cheap labor has helped China become the world’s factory. However, as China’s labor surplus is running out, the position of workers is changing. In A New Deal for China’s Workers, New York University’s Cynthia Estlund examines the evolution of workers’ rights and protests in China. Drawing a comparison with the struggle of workers to attain more rights in the US, Estlund asks whether China’s workers will succeed in securing a New Deal with Chinese characteristics.
Sep 24, 2017
Andrew Polk on the 19th Party Congress
Andrew Polk on the 19th Party Congress by Jordan Schneider
Sep 20, 2017
Scott Kennedy on Innovation in China
Scott Kennedy on Innovation in China by Jordan Schneider