The Ezra Klein Show
The Ezra Klein Show
New York Times Opinion
The Office is Dying. It’s Time to Rethink How We Work.
Over the past year, many places have returned to something approximating a prepandemic normal. Restaurants are filling up again. Airports and hotels are packed. Even movie theaters have made a comeback. But that hasn’t been the case for the office. Only about a third of office workers are back in the office full time. And that isn’t likely to change dramatically any time soon: Recent surveys asked executives about the share of their workers who would be back in the office five days a week in the future. In 2021 the response was 50 percent; now it’s down to 20 percent. But the alternatives — remote and hybrid work — come with their own problems. In many cases, remote work has become synonymous with meeting fatigue, the collapse of work-life balance, overwhelming amounts of email and Slack messages and awkward attempts at social connection. And hybrid work setups often represent what some have called the worst of both work worlds: long commutes to half-empty offices, just to sit on Zoom calls all day. That leaves office workers in what feels like a work purgatory: The office is dying, but a new, viable model of work has yet to be born. And that liminal space raises all sorts of new questions: What is the office actually for? What will the postoffice future of work look like? And if the future of work means working from home in some capacity, how do we make that future better for everyone involved? Those questions are at the center of Anne Helen Petersen and Charlie Warzel’s book, “Out of Office: The Big Problem and Bigger Promise of Working From Home.” Petersen is a longtime culture writer who writes the newsletter Culture Study; Warzel is a veteran technology reporter who writes the newsletter Galaxy Brain for The Atlantic. In “Out of Office” they argue that the core problem with current remote and hybrid work setups is this: Workers have left the physical office, but they have taken the broken culture of the office with them. The result is widespread dysfunction but also immense opportunity: If we take this moment to rethink not only where we work but also how we work, then the possibilities are endless. Mentioned: “The Case Against Loving Your Job” by The Ezra Klein Show “Stop. Breathe. We Can’t Keep Working Like This” by The Ezra Klein Show “Think Bigger About Remote Work” by Adam Ozimek “I’m Worried About Chicago” by Matthew Yglesias "The Nowhere Office" by Julia Hobsbawm Book Recommendations: In the Age of the Smart Machine by Shoshana Zuboff The Myth of the Paperless Office by Abigail J. Sellen and Richard H. R. Harper Liquidated by Karen Ho Essential Labor by Angela Garbes _This episode is guest hosted by Rogé Karma, the senior editor for “The Ezra Klein Show.” Rogé has been with the show since July 2019, when it was based at Vox. He works closely with Ezra on everything related to the show, from editing to interview prep to guest selection. At Vox, he also wrote articles and conducted interviews on topics ranging from policing and racial justice to democracy reform and the coronavirus._ Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at ​​“The Ezra Klein Show” is produced by Annie Galvin and Rogé Karma; fact-checking by Michelle Harris, Mary Marge Locker and Kate Sinclair; original music by Isaac Jones; mixing by Sonia Herrero and Isaac Jones; audience strategy by Shannon Busta. Special thanks to Kristin Lin, Kristina Samulewski, Nicholas Bloom, Adam Ozimek, Julia Hobsbawm and Sheela Subramanian.
1 hr 32 min
True Crime Garage
True Crime Garage
Murder in Moab /// Part 2 /// 606
Murder in Moab /// Part 2 /// 606 Part 2 of 2 On August 16, 2021 Sean-Paul Schulte reported to police in Utah that his daughter Kylen Schulte and her wife Crystal Turner were missing. Sean-Paul had been unable to reach Kylen for a couple of days and this was not normal at all. In fact this sent the anxious father into a frenzy of activity. Sean-Paul lived in Montana and so he contacted everyone he could think of to try to help locate his daughter. He called the hospital, he called the jail and he called Kylen’s place of work frequently. No one had seen the girls since Friday the 13th. This was at Woody’s Tavern where the two ladies met with friends. During the visit Kylen and Crystal talked about some “creepy guy” that had spooked them at their campsite. Unfortunately on August 18, 2021 Kylen and Crystal were found dead and so began one of the most bizarre stories to come out of peaceful Moab, Utah. This case is still UNSOLVED and the Grand County Sheriff’s Office is still seeking information from the public. Please call the Sheriff’s office with any information at (435) 259-8115. Beer of the Week - Run Jewelius Run from Tactical Brewing Company Garage Grade - 5 out of 5 bottle caps Recommended Reading - Trailed; One woman’s quest to solve the Shenandoah murders. By Kathryn Miles Our show - True Crime Garage “Off the Record” is available only on Stitcher Premium. For a FREE month of listening go to and use promo code GARAGE
46 min
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